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I have shot a clicker for over 25 years, wish I would of shot one from the start, I have made some modification over the years.
Mine makes no noise, just a light bump when you get to full draw.
The #1 thing it does is, you release the arrow at the same draw weight EVERY TIME, not every now and then, but every time.
If you just short draw 1/8 of an inch it changes everything.
Especially from a treestand, drawing bent over shooting straight down.
Try it with a clicker and you will swear, someone lengthened your draw length.
Try practicing at your point on range, draw the clicker all the way, but don’t make it click. watch how far your arrow drops, then hit the clicker, and watch them stack in the bulls eye.
You do have to have the mental capacity to make them work, if you are a spastick shot and totally out of control, I’m not sure it will help.
I see so many good people struggle at archery shoots, cant come within 3″ of full draw some times.
As Jim Carrie said in dumb & dumber, “I LIKE’UM ALOT”
First, it ain’t the arrow…….. it’s the Indian, ( no disrespect meant ) yes, high EFOC can have advantages, however it’s not a magic arrow, just a very good arrow, with proven advantages.
As has been said, there are so many variables to each and every shot, it some times is amazing we can kill anything.
With that said, my 2cents wouldbe, buck fever, short draw, then arrow over spined because did not get to full draw, staying in paradox longer, blacked out at the shot, did not hit where you aimed, buck moved at the shot……..etc.
This is the offside humerus bone from a hog shot with a 50lb longbow, 550 grain arrow with a tuffhead, after it blew a chunk off of the ball socket.
We all strive to become the best hunter we can be, however, we hunt in a moving world, with live animals, that can and do move, in an environment that can be hostile to both man & beast.
Thanks DWCphoto.
Preston, the main thing my son Caleb could not tell me, was what had happened, so, I assumed the worst, which is a gut shot.
It takes about 6-7 hours, sometime longer, all depends on what was hit, however, after about 5-6hr they are very sick and don’t want to move, which is what happened on my buck this year.
No one wants a bad hit, however, if the deer is hit, you need to kill it, if you go after it to soon you stand the risk of bumping it and never seeing it again, they die a 100% of the time from a gut shot, their is no recovering from that hit, but you must use wisdom.
My son’s buck was hit, but just a superficial wound that he would of 100% recovered from, no worse for ware.
So much so, that he came by the same stand the very next day.
As you can see, it was just under the hide, very little muscle was cut.
My son & I went to one of these spots, set up a few game cameras over water and some trails, a few bucks used the trail, but only does would drink.
Put up a stand and kept watching it until a nice 3×3 came there, I told Caleb to hunt it the next day he had off, he text me he has a 4×3 & 3×3 coming to him. A little later he text me, he shot the 4×3 slight quartering at him. I tell him do not go after it, let the arrow kill him, I will get there just before dark to help him look.
It had only been about 3 1/2 hours which is not enough time to kill a buck gut shot, I thought lets just look close by to see how good the sign is, if he is not right there back out & come back the next day, caleb points me to the trail he took out, we cant find anything, just some tracks, that’s it.
I ask him to tell me about the shot & where he thinks he hit him and he cant explain what he saw, he tells me the arrow was not farther back than mid body, and the arrow was hanging down as he ran with the fletching sticking straight up, but he is not sure about anything he saw.
We look for blood but can not find one drop, I tell him lets back out, I tell him one of two things happened, the shot is not what you think it was, or we are on the wrong trail. I tell him I don’t think you hit him good as he was sure we where on the right trail. I tell him, get in the stand before light to see if anything comes in, then go look for him.
At around 7:30 I get a text your not going to believe this he’s coming in, I can see the hit, it went in & out he’s not hurt at all, I text back, broadside or quartering away shot only.
Then a few minutes later I get a call, “smoked him” I can see blood from my tree, I tell him I’m on my way.
As we follow a blind mans blood trail, he only went about 50 yards. As we are standing over him I can see the relief all over his face, he tells me he could not sleep last night, kept running what had happened through his head.
His first shot hit on the opposite side he shot at….. the buck jumped the string and ducked the arrow, it went just under the skin at the top of his right shoulder exiting about 4-5 ” below that, hitting the ground and keeping the arrow in him, as he ran Caleb saw it, but could not believe his eyes as he shot him on his left side.
My son was shooting a set of hot carbon foam ILF limbs on a 14″ riser pulling just over 60lbs with a tuffhead meathead on the front, it jumped through him like he was invisible slamming into the ground snapping the arrow as he ran, the tuffhead might be sticking out somewhere in china….
Hi Joe, I change arrows about as often as I change my drawers….lol
I will share what I do and how I work up an arrow, but I will have to go and get all of the data for ya.
Like Peterson, I like to start with my head weight, and build from there ( experience has taught me this is the easiest way ) I start with a full length shaft, shoot at short yardage like 7-10 yds, depending on how crazy the shaft flew depends on what I do next. working from the back, I cut until they fly straight as an arrow…..
All of my risers are from center shot, OUT – about 1/8 – 3/8 this is most important when working on a high EFOC arrow, if your shelf is to close to center shot you will get a tone of FALSE reads that the spine is week, you really want your riser to be more selfbow’esk, shooting AROUND the riser.
With carbon arrows they are very forgiving with weight changes, even up to a 100 grains, however very sensitive to cutting.
My EFOC arrow are twice as forgiving as regular arrows, and seem to carry there trajectory down range better, so there is now down side.
I like to stick around the 600-800 grain arrows and EFOC 28% and up.
Thanks for putting this together for those wanting to work up a UEFOC arrow, as you already know my friend it’s a better mouse trap.
Check this out, I love it……
” Phil,
Hi Kingwouldbe
I’ll try and explain why I was so impressed with your photographs, but first a little bit of skeletal anatomy and osseous pyhsiology if I may. The “knuckle” or Epiphysis you mention is the rounded head which fits into a socket (acetabulum) that forms a joint in the leg of your hog. The honeycomb you mention is the trabeculea of the cancellous bone, a softer type of bone structure which is inside the harder outer cortical hard bone. (Now the biomechanics part).
You have to remember that your hog was standing up and fully weight bearing when the arrow the arrow hit, so the bone was under compresson and all the leg joints were in a congruent loaded position, essentially making the structure stronger. Your arrow hit the leg just below the transition part of the bone shaft and the epiphysial condyle, possibly the stronest part of the bone. When your arrow hit the bone, it set up a classic 3 point bending moment within the bone. Both ends of the bone were fixed in their joints and the force of your arrow bent the bone like a bent bow. In 3 point bending fractures, the force generated at a single point on one side of the bone is greater than the reaction force on the opposite side of the stable ends of the bone, so the bone begins to bend. Just like a bow bending, the bending bone on the inside curve is under compression and the bone on the outside of the curve is in extension. When the extension force experienced on the outside curve of the bone exceeded it’s elastic modulus, a crack propogates from the internal application of the force, which in your case was your arrow. So the bone on the opposite side of the point of impact essentially explodes.
So why was I so impressed with your photographs …. well … you hit the bone in possibly the strongest area. The bone is quite short where you hit with thick cortical walls , so the bending moments generated will be small, but the force required to bend the bone will be very high. To apply a force to propogate a butterfly comminuted fracture of that quality is no mean feat.
Hope this helps …. and my background ? .. I’m head of research for a European medical research company.
Small mistake … when I said “a crack propogates from the internal application of the force,” I should have typed a crack propogates TO the internal application of the force,…. sorry guys my mistake.”
Phil, That was so outstanding, I had to read it a few times, I think I’ll read it again just for fun.
Thank you, Thank you, Thank you,
I’m just the test dummy 😯 Doc figures it out, tells everyone what he thinks, I go & try it, come back with info……
I try to remember what I’m suppose-ta do, and always forget what I’m suppose-ta do…..lol
I keep saying I need to wright a cheat sheet that I can pull out and see what I’m suppose-ta do….. never happens.
I’m just like you guys, I’m so jacked up over the kill, I get lost in the moment.
Thank God, I sometimes remember, I should maybe take a picture of this.
I did get little blackie on a head camera, the kill shot and everything, then I pulled out my video camera and got him fighting the arrow, just have to figure out how to edit it.
Dave Peterson, this is my all time mind blown experience. This Boar I shot a few years ago, went about 400 yards with this hole in his heart….. how…. you can’t…… it’s not possible… he even went about 150 up hill following his sows.
Thanks Guy’s..
Well, I see my friend Troy has developed a speech impediment…..lol, that’s what happens when you try to reason, with the unreasonable….. it gets tiring some times. That’s why I’m putting Doc Ashby’s name in the hat for ” Saint Ashby” …….. oops way to much sin for Saint hood……lol
King — you’ve kilt elk and many hogzillas. I am of the uneducated (no experience with hogs) impression that huge hogs are even tougher than elk. You agree? That’s a Tuffhead…. I mean tough one………. I think we need to define TOUGH, are we talking the will to keep going and not give up….. are we talking the ability to inflict a wound……or are we talking the ability to take a boat-load of punishment and keep going……etc.
For a recent example, the last elk I killed, a young cow, the wood shaft broke off an inch behind the Toughhead 300 yet the heavy head had enough momentum to make it into if not through the heart. That animal barely make 25 yards … That is amazing, but if you think about it, your broadhead, the tuffhead 300 was as heavy as a lot of compound shooters whole arrow, ( my first thought was that the arrow my have went in then bounced back out, was there any blood on the shaft? if no blood on the shaft, then I think your right, the broadhead drove it’s self through……… That my friend is a mind blower!!!!!!!!!!
as opposed to yours, above, harder hit yet went so much farther. This falls into the category of taking punishment and keep on going, both Bull Elk & Big Boars can take a lot of punishment, A big Bull can weigh 2-3 times the weight of a big boar, so the amount of punishment, pound for pound, has to go to the big boar, however because of there greater size, the big bull can also take a boat-load of punishment.
Those who have done both enough to make an informed decision say that elk are tougher to kill fast than moose or bear. I’m thinking that giant hogs are tougher than elk, thus the toughest NA animal to kill, thus the ultimate test of an arrow setup short of water buffalo. Your thoughts?
My opinion wouldbe, big boars are tougher to inflict a killing wound in, easier to penetrate shooting from behind, on a non vital shot, you’ll loose both…. both have an incredible ability to take punishment and keep going. The biggest difference is, big boars grow tougher and tougher, not just size, but actually harder and harder structure, the more they fight the tougher they become, they can become one big scar. Big bulls on the other hand really just grow bigger, same hide thickness, little if any scar tissue.
Both shot into the lung area, in my opinion, Elk are easier to get enough penetration into the vitals, both can take a lot of punishment, Bull Elk because of his size and his muscle structure, Big Boars, because of his shield and dense muscle structure, and some times just his angry attitude.
Joe, I don’t know if you ever heard how I got the nickname “kingwouldbe” my good friend Ron Murry and I, and a bunch of other guys were hunting Santa Catalina Island circa 1980, there was about 30 bowhunters and a mountain of gear being stowed below deck.
The deck hands were just shoving all of the gear down below, they said to put your name on your stuff, my friend Ron had a marking pen, I asked him to put my name on my arrow box’s, yes arrow box’s, we would take 3 dozen arrows and some times you would run out, and pick up one you found, Bowhunting Paradise, ten kill days where not uncommon.
As we got to the dock on the island, the deck hands started calling out your name to pick up your gear so it did not just pile up, the guy said; “kingwouldbe”…… “kingwouldbe”…… he stared yelling “kingwouldbe” no one moved…… then my friend elbowed me, said; that’s you! everyone laughed as I walked up to get my ” kingwouldbe” arrows…. it stuck, the whole trip guys called me kingwouldbe for laughs.
Steve look at the pic with the sow…… it’s just a stub.
It’s good to be the king…….
Right at the tip of the arrow you can see where the tip of the broadhead hit the bone, I think it “POPPED” the leg-bone in the first quarter inch, then blew a big chunk off the back side of the leg-bone as it passed through.
The broadhead was still sharp with “ZERO” roll over on the edges, I could of washed it off and hunted with it, however I would not, I like a finely honed edge, but the edge durability was outstanding.
This is the back side of the leg bone, it blew off a big chunk of bone.
NOT ALL BROADHEADS ARE EQUAL: Having the requisite qualities, such as strength or ability, for a task or situation:
Thank God we have lot’s to choose from, careful though, “some only catch hunters” I’m glad I had one that was up to the task.
The Tuffhead not only went through the humerus leg bone, it also cut the near rib in two, cut both lungs ( yes, that’s a double lung shot ) and cut the off side rib and exited with a 3 inch wide wound.
Smithhammer, um……… it usually ends with a story like this, ” I shot this monster boar right in the lungs…… he ran forever…….. lost the blood trail….. must of been a poor shot.
I believe this is what Doctor Ashby was trying to convey to us….. with an enhanced set up, you can breach heavy bone consistently.
