AnonymousJune 16, 2017 at 7:21 pmPost count: 124
Completely open ended here, and seeking guidance on a new arrow set-up. Game? Whitetails, black bear, and MAYBE elk.
Bow – 52″ 50# Bear Kodiak Magnum
Draw Length – 29″
Release – fingers; split.
Taking suggestions and advice on total arrow weight, broadheads, inserts, etc. Seeking high FOC. Only caveat is that it should be a modern shaft, and likely to use lighted nocks. Prefer as thin a diameter shaft as possible for penetration, wind drift, etc.
PtaylorMemberJune 17, 2017 at 9:31 amPost count: 577
Hey Sean. This is just my own opinion here, but I don’t like lighted nocks. Because in order for the light to turn on the string has to push a button at the base of the nock groove (where the string sits and pushes the arrow). So you’ve got a moveable part where the contact between string and arrow happens and all the energy gets transferred…Seems like something could go wrong, or the arrow fly weird from the string not hitting the arrow nock perfectly straight on. And, the integrity of the nock has been reduced to fill that space with light and batter instead of one complete piece of plastic (or wood for self nockers). That’s just my thoughts, aside from the legal and ethical debate around lighted nocks.
As far as what arrow would work for that set up. I try a .400 spine arrow with 125 grains up front, or a .340 spine arrow with lots (+250-350) grains up front. I have a 50# center shot longbow and can use 28″ .400 spine with minimal weight up front or 31″ .340 spine with 300 grains up front.
David CoulterMemberJune 22, 2017 at 4:31 amPost count: 2262
Hi Sean, because I’m relatively new at bow hunting I opted to follow the Ashby guides. I ended up with about 630 gr total with 350 up front including the insert. There are a lot of opinions about all this but I wanted to build in as much advantage as I could, knowing my ranges would be kept short. I get really good arrow flight and I’ve had excellent penetration in the few deer I killed. None went more than about 40 yards. I’m using Tuffheads and couldn’t be happier with them. My bow is a 46 # longbow and the shafts are Beman Bowhunter 400s. I have my target arrows and stumping arrows all matched to my hunting arrows.
There’s also a thread here where members have listed there set ups and that might be of interest to you. Enjoy, dwc
Col MikeMemberJune 22, 2017 at 1:49 pmPost count: 910
My 52″ Elkheart at 28″. I use the trad only 500 carbons start at 30″ with 100gr brass insert, 300gr field point (later add the same weight tuff head) with 100gr steel adapter. Bare shaft tune (instructions per Troy Breeding on Tuff head site). Once they shoot from 5-25 yds I will fletch with A&A fletching. Think I end up with arrow length of 29 1/4 “. Shoot the broad head with fletched shaft. Shoot groups with both fletched and not with target point and of course the broad head is always shot with fletching. Bingo it’s tuned. Total arrow weight I shoot is 750gr with 500 up front EFOC per Dr. Ed’s data. This will take any north American game.
I also shoot blunts for roving but they are a little lighter something like 400 I even use 300 grain screw ins for 3D as they are easier to pull out then Joe’s big brass points. It appears that these carbon arrows are so forgiving they don’t notice. I have even cut shattered ends up to an inch off and they still hit the mark.
Have fun and welcome back—trust the shoulder is better. Forgot to mention EFOC is 33%
Ed AshbyMemberJune 22, 2017 at 8:35 pmPost count: 816
Col Mike wrote: “This will take any north American game.”
Don’t sell your arrow setup short Col Mike. While I believe one should always use all the bow one can handle, if 52# draw and that arrow setup was what I had to use I’d feel comfortable up through Cape and Asian buffalo. Elephant, hippo and giraffe? Think I’d want a bit more bow and a bit more arrow.
Col MikeMemberJune 23, 2017 at 4:23 pmPost count: 910
Ed thanks for those comments. Although I must admit that I wouldn’t feel comfortable facing any buffalo.
One of the things that sometimes gets over looked in setting up and tuning bow and arrow–is how well the archer shoots. And as we know lighter arrows and points have taken many prey. Having said that I think that anyone who doesn’t at least experiment with your work and EFOC is really missing out on some of the fun.
We have discussed this before but it needs repeating—the heavy arrow with majority of weight up front not only produces the humane kill we all want but in my humble opinion they improve (at least for me) my accuracy. We can get into the physics involved and sometimes that gives me a head ache–but that momentum induced by the heavy front end really adjusts for minor problems with draw and release, not to mention the adrenaline rush of a hunting shot.
I get many comments when on 3D courses about my giant field points and minimal fletching. But the proof is at the point of impact. And as Troy points out it’s fun to shoot some bare shafts just to make your point (pun intended).
Sorry been absent from the forum for some time trust we can get some good discussions going again.
By the way Doc—how are you doing?
AnonymousJuly 6, 2017 at 6:11 pmPost count: 124
Well, I came up on two dozen Easton Gamegetter aluminum 2016 500 spine for $45/dozen. Sold. Yes, they have vanes on them but that easily corrected (vane stripper and acetone; done).
100 grain brass inserts and a point weight test set on the way in. I’ll start full length (32″) with 100 inserts and various point weights to start, all bareshaft tested, and adjust/cut from there. With aluminum, I may not be able to get much beyond 20% FOC, but overall arrow weight and momentum should be excellent. 2-blade, COC, single-bevel will be up front.
More as this develops.
David CoulterMemberAugust 24, 2019 at 3:53 pmPost count: 2262
I’m getting caught up here after some time away. I’ve been reading and reminiscing about building up my arrows. What I did and I think you’ll find support for this idea, is to start with the head and work back. I did this by accident, as some 225 gr Tuffheads landed in my mailbox and I had to figure out what to do with them. I also wanted to build target and stumpers that would be the same or really close to my hunting arrows. I had the 255 gr Tuffheads with a 75 steel adapter to match the 300 gr field points available. I used 50 gr inserts with 400 Beman Bowhunters and ended up with about 635 gr weight with about 28% foc. My stumpers required a bit more work. The Judos are about 135 gr, so I put 125 gr adapters and 100 gr inserts. Somebody else can check the math on that, but it came out very close to my hunters. Dang those things stick into a stump. I target shoot 20 yards and under for the most part with a few out at about 35 yards for giggles. These arrows fly just fine. When they don’t I know whose fault it is.
Raymond CoffmanModeratorAugust 25, 2019 at 9:07 amPost count: 1056
Yes, on starting at the head and working back —
Sounds like you got your arrows the way you want them and flying true. I Havn’t picked up any new bows, and I am happy with my current set up – for the moment anyway.
Depending on the bow – I am running meatheads / tuffhead up front in a 675 -720gr arrow ( axis / gold tip )28+ foc. Wanted above the bone threshold. Shoot fine out of my bows to 25yds ( my max).
Scout aka Ray
David CoulterMemberSeptember 14, 2019 at 10:54 amPost count: 2262
Just a thought. When I was building my hunting arrows I found Troy Breedings posts very helpful. It would be cool to edit those posts, with his permission, and put them some place handy. His suggestions made the process relatively smooth and could be a help to anyone getting started or having tuning issues. dwc
ps. As I remember Troy was running full Ashby, which was my chosen avenue.
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