Duck816November 22, 2011 at 4:04 pmPost count: 10
Last evening an acquaintance of mine contacted me to let me know he and his father in-law took an 8 point on the last day of Pennsylvania’s White Tail archery season. At first I thought that this was great news. I knew that he still hunted with a wheel bow but he did so from the ground. I felt as though I was just inches from converting him to traditional tackle. My mood changed when he told me the story of how he “harvested” animal. I quoted the word “harvested” because it seemed a lot more like torture. Apparently this individual and his father in-law were sitting in their living room when they saw a buck wondering through the field behind the house. So they got up and grabbed, of all things, a crossbow with only two bolts. They got to the woods and kicked up the buck straight away. The deer popped up at 50 yards and took off. His father in-law took a running shot with a crossbow at 50 plus yards! It was a gut shot. The arrow didn’t even completely pass through. Instead of giving the deer time to expire they chased it. For the next few hours they kicked the deer up and chase it again and again. While they chased they attempted another shot and stuck the last bolt into a fence post. When they tried to retrieve the bolt its expandable broad head broke off. A few more hours pass and the deer finally collapses from exhaustion. Not blood loss. Exhaustion. At this point all they have is a worthless pen knife, a tip less bolt and their wits, or lack thereof. They use the bolt and proceed to aim for the heart, miss, pull the bolt out, reload the crossbow and repeat. I don’t know how many times it took exactly. To be sure it was too many. I was heartbroken. Not only because the animal suffered greatly but also because an individual, who I thought was well on this way to becoming a traditionalist, through ethics out the window.
I know that many of you are just as disgusted as I am. However, I’m not sharing this story so that we can all bash these two men; even though they deserve some bashing. I’m sharing it as a reminder of the importance doing traditionally. We Must Pass On Ethics! Not only to the next generation but also to those we call our friends. I want to commend everyone who hunts traditionally for being an ethical role model. Even if you don’t get the credit you deserve. It’s not easy doing things the way we do. We put in long hours in the woods scouting, patterning and passing up shots not to mention the time it takes to become a proficient instinctive shooter. On top of that we put up with other, more modern, archers calling us crazy. Even though many time we harvest more game. So why do we do hunt in this way. I would say it’s mostly for selfish reasons. Anyone who has put in the time and harvested an animal knows how incredibly gratifying it can be. I would say that at least for me that extreme satisfaction is the reason I hunt with a longbow from the ground. Regardless of why just keep it in the back of your mind that perhaps your example will keep shots like this from happening. Or maybe you will pull someone who uses a compound bow over to our side, maybe not. Whatever your reasons or the outcomes, keep it up! Continue to do things the hard way. You will have more satisfaction and sleep so much better. Cheers to all of you! Keep up the good work!
Jeremy HoldenNovember 22, 2011 at 4:11 pmPost count: 60
Thank you for sharing you feelings and the story. It is amazing what happens to someone when they see antlers. I experienced a poacher and a mighty fine buck one season.
My son is 11 and has started hunting, not just with me, but hunting. Now it’s been with a shotgun so far. But the point I’m going to make, and am trying to instill in him, is that ethics are what you do when no one is watching.
bobmack11qqNovember 22, 2011 at 7:33 pmPost count: 24
Some people just dont get.They are out for the quick kill. Here in Pa. our early archery season ended with out me filling my tag. I passed on two small bucks a 6 pointer and a half rack,both young bucks.Both bucks was less than 10 yards broadside and never saw me sitting on my bucket.That was my joy ,being that close that i could smell them,It was very windy and I was down wind so they didnt smell me.Our rifle season starts on monday after thanksgiving.Ill be out there but not with a rifle.Ill be carring my long bow.And taking only the shot I know I can make if it comes.If it dont that fine also I still will enjoy GODS gife to us all.Pray for you friends to see what we see and be blessed as we are when we are out with our bows.
William WarrenMemberNovember 23, 2011 at 2:09 pmPost count: 1380
A gut shot is bad no matter what you’re shooting and just as bad, is extending the range beyond a weapons true capability. Being ill prepared to go on a hunt, if this can be called a hunt.
To their credit, they stayed with the animal until they retrieved it.
The big question is, did they learn anything from this? And how much has this played out over and again in the forests and fields of America this year now that crossbows are legal almost everywhere? What, I wonder, will they learn from this?
Duck816November 23, 2011 at 8:26 pmPost count: 10
In the days that passed I have spoken with my acquaintance from the story and shared the same thing with him that I shared with all of you. I can say that the younger of the two individual, the one I know, is understanding and acknowledges the errors he made. Only time will tell what was actually learned. The individuals involved both have an open invitation to bow hunt with me during rifle and late archery seasons in PA. I pray they take me up on it. I think it could be an opportunity for them to continue to learn. Not that I will be the one teaching them. I’m sure we will be learning together. I still love that every time I enter the woods there is another lesson. I’m a continuous student.
jmsmithyMemberNovember 24, 2011 at 3:32 amPost count: 300
Wonder I applaud you. You’re a better man than I. To my way of thinking, the implement here is virtually irrelevant. Compound, recurve, crossbow, atlatl etc etc. I am just as disgusted at what was done. Period. I would have an incredibly difficult time ever sharing my precious time afield with these two.
That being said, and in this time when we all are giving thanks for our beloved forest denizens and the pleasure they give us, I am very impressed at your ability to try and rehab at least one of them. It is a noble effort, one which I applaud and, hopefully, you are successful in.
Good luck, God Bless you and yours and have a wonderful Thanksgiving.
RipforceNovember 25, 2011 at 5:55 pmPost count: 225
That type of story is why I gave up hunting all together a few years back! I now ONLY hunt the Traditional way as well as my son LimbLover! Sad to say but I know a lot of so called hunters that would have done the same thing! If killing a deer was my only objective I could have did that several times already, hopefully these 2 have learned a lesson! Keep at them there is always hope!
CareyEMemberNovember 26, 2011 at 6:14 pmPost count: 111
As a life long Pennsylvanian, it seems to me that “Get your buck no matter what”, is a way of life. Even more so now that cross guns have invaded OUR archery season. I’m afraid that your story was probably repeated more than once this year here in PA. It’s today’s “Culture of Easy” that is to blame in my opinion. The cross gun is just the means to that end.
Lawrence HansenMemberNovember 26, 2011 at 11:20 pmPost count: 16
Perhaps somethings missing for these two? A quote from Barebow/Dennis Dunn: “Life is not measured by the number of breaths you take, but by the number of moments that take tour breath away” Anonymous.
Why else be out there if you cannot connect with what leaves us in awe and breathless?
Todd SmithNovember 29, 2011 at 6:05 pmPost count: 169
It is really a shame that there are folks like that out there, but… there are folks like that out there.
There is an old Native American quote, I don’t remember the author but I have always liked it, especially since I always wished I had been born Native American. “All honorable people or of the same tribe.”
I’d like to say that all un-honorable are too, but in fairness, they are simply unenlightened. Who knows where the wires got crossed, or the connection to earth and sky was lost, but it must have been.
The only reason I can think of for actions like that is ignorance… I hope something happens to change them some day, something that will open their eyes to their cruelty and their ‘lost ways’… todd
David PetersenMemberNovember 30, 2011 at 12:41 amPost count: 2762
Well said, Todd. Unfortunately, the modern hunting industry and media are deeply “unenlightened” and spreading that selfish sloppy attitude to clueless wannabees every day. Judging from my own experience and that of others I grew up with, young men are by nature bloodthirsty if not intentionally cruel. Most of us grow out of it. A few never do. Quite a few, it seems. I agree with other posters here that such disgusting cruelty has nothing to do with choice of hunting weapon — I have seen some, thankfully not often, amazingly stupid and ugly behavior and words from people carrying stickbows. But I also believe that trad bowhunters are, in general, a higher cut ethically and spiritually because we already have a mature attitude toward hunting “sucess” and “failure,” as reflected by choosing to carry the weapon least likely to bring home the meat and horns. In short, we tend to be far more secure in ourselves, thus far less likely to become crazed when circumstance creates temptation. IMHO
William WarrenMemberNovember 30, 2011 at 1:23 amPost count: 1380
Great quote Todd. I agree there is a huge disconnect in our world where people have no idea what is real anymore but at the end of the day we can only really control our own actions. From what I’ve observed lately I don’t have much confidence that things are going to get any better any time soon. Let’s all just keep doing what we do and try to let it rub off wherever it will.
Don ThomasMemberDecember 2, 2011 at 12:33 amPost count: 339
I must respectfully disagree about the irrelevance of the weapon. Fifty years after the fact, some of the things I did at first seem totally inept, but because I was hunting with a recurve, I never got close enough to hurt anything! Simply getting 25 yards away from a big game animal requires at least a certain level of skill. The crossbow, on the other hand, allows almost anyone to become an instant “bowhunter”. I doubt these individuals would have been able to hurt this deer with traditional tackle. Chalk up another victory for the crossbow lobby, and weep for what “bowhunting” has become. Don
Steve Sr.December 2, 2011 at 2:47 pmPost count: 344
Much to give thought to here and true, for years I have frowned upon what not only bowhunting has become but hunting in general.
No longer is the journey the main part of the hunt and only the “results” can be photographed.
Flip back in time to the Little Delta and find the photos of such from Fred and crew.
IT WAS about the journey, the hardships, the obsticles to over come and “stand proud” in a REAL accomplishment.
Today’s “accomplishments” too often (IMHO only) are only viewed as meritable if “inches” and “score” is involved.
Preaching to the choir here, I feel but pick up any “hunting” catalog and view the objects you feel are meant to A. Get your dollars and B. Do so by *removing an obsticle* that (they say) you wont have to overcome.
In a word……….easier.
Yep, I could make my bowhunting “more difficult” by following Jawge’s example and “make my own” and I HAVE NO DOUBT that that pot of the rainbow on the end of any blood trail from such would be ONE H OF A TROPHY! (regardless of size). Yet I do not, feeling I am pushing my sensible limitations as is. Equal in talents we are not.
It’s been a difficult year, few shots to date and yet I cannot call the season any kind of “failure”, missed big buck at 7 yards or so included. Sour grapes some say? So be it. I feel every unsuccessful day in the field is just yet another pound of satisfaction that will be added to when (not if, LOL) I connect.
The above example is a rare one, I hope, yet does point fingers (again IMHO) as to what the ONLY goal is to many.
Kill something…….regardless of how, when, whom it steps on, suffering, etc etc.
It will always be the journey and obsticles we overcome that make the end result the best it could be.
Pass it down!
SteveMcDMemberDecember 4, 2011 at 2:26 pmPost count: 874
Ethics are the values a person inherently carries with them. A by the time a person reaches young adolesence they certainly know the difference between what is right and what is wrong. The two “hunters” here were just slobs. I’m sure many hunters regardless of the equipment they use would be appalled by this.
The operative word here is Ethics. I’m sure the old gentlemen or woman who still hunts with a 30-30 Winchester considers themselves “traditional” too.
xBows are not the evil incernate, it was actually the Longbow that replaced the xBow as the superior weapon of choice. Even today’s compounds are far more superior than the xBow. That Tech Argument was lost when the Hollis Allen Compound for handicapped hunters was allowed in the Archery Season.
Just my 2 cents.
Bruce SmithhammerDecember 4, 2011 at 3:21 pmPost count: 2514
xBows are not the evil incernate, it was actually the Longbow that replaced the xBow as the superior weapon of choice. Even today’s compounds are far more superior than the xBow.
For me, the issue with x-bows has nothing to do with which weapon is ‘superior.’ It has to do with the fact that it simply isn’t a bow – it’s a bolt shooting machine, with a trigger, which shouldn’t be allowed during archery season.
That, and the fact that too many people who gravitate to modern x-bows seem to be gun hunters (not archers) who want to hunt the early season without having to put the time and effort into learning to become proficient with a bow. Thankfully, for now at least, they are not allowed in Idaho during archery season.
SteveMcDMemberDecember 4, 2011 at 5:10 pmPost count: 874
SH.. I understand. I do a lot of hunting in “Bow Only” Areas that are open through all of my state’s seasons. However, come Gun Season, you almost never see a Compound hunter in these woods either. They have foresaken their Mechanical Arrow Launchers for the Rifle or Shotgun. And that’s pretty much the way it is with them. Not all, but I’d say 99% of them.
In my opinion, the Compound is not a Bow either. It’s a machine. And that’s not a derogatory statement. It’s a statement of fact.
Bruce SmithhammerDecember 4, 2011 at 5:18 pmPost count: 2514
Agreed, Steve. As a I was writing that, I was thinking about how much of what I was saying could apply to compounds as well. And I know a number of guys who hunt archery-only season with a compound for the primary reason of scouting for rifle season, not because they are committed bowhunters. On the other hand, I know compound hunters who I would consider to be damn good bowhunters. Modern compounds and x-bows both blur the line between what is truly still a “bow” and what is simply a machine.
But if I have to draw the line somewhere, I’d draw it at x-bows, since it just seems to be one step (or several) even further away from a true bow, and that trend seems to be going more and more in that direction.
CareyEMemberDecember 5, 2011 at 7:12 pmPost count: 111
Sadly many of todays’s “New” hunters, lack the dedication to become proficient bowhunters. The go to Cabelas (no offense intended) one night and leave “hunt ready” for tomorrow morning, is wrong. You simply cannot be a shining example of what is good about hunting. Also, I’m pretty sure Fred Bear and Glenn St.Charles didn’t say “Smoked um” when they arrowed an animal.
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