[Greg Ragan]

in reply to: Workin on yer problems #60605

Helps me to practice on form without aiming…..separation of the aiming process with the form work. I use a combination of shooting long distance (about 50 yards) and blank bale work up close. Try not to aim and only concentrate on form.

For me I see that the aiming part starts to be the subconscious thing. When we drive down the road we stay in between the lines even though we are not concentrating, or even looking directly on doing that or even consciously looking at the lines. Your arrows will group the same way.

[Greg Ragan]

in reply to: Re-Thinking old Thoughts on Woodies #49185

I like a longer feather also and I shoot a 5 1/2 inch parabolic.

With more feather and my wood shafts cut as short as I can with my draw length I feel I get quick recovery and very stable flight especially with a big wing (broadhead) on the front of my arrow.

There is another way that works but it goes against the current trend of way longer than draw length front loaded carbons and tiny fletch. IMO it is a simpler system and has a track record of proven results.

[Greg Ragan]

in reply to: This may be a dumb question but.. #15357

One of the things I love about my Hill Style bows. No need for silencers if you use a well waxed heavy hunting string. Q:lol:uiet!

[Greg Ragan]

in reply to: Success to me means getting the meat???? #15345

DK wrote: I talked to a guy last year who didn’t recover his high country mule deer until two days later. He said “but at least I got my buck”. What a butthole.

DK

This is what I am talking about…. The guys that think looking for buzzards and crows a few days later is a tracking skill…..

Hold your nose and take the hero pic….give me a break. To me that is “failure”

[Greg Ragan]

in reply to: Where the Bucks Go!? #46646

Around here (which is much like PA mountains) the patterns change pretty regularly. The summer pattern has the deer down low in the open hardwoods and fields on a regular schedule.

Once the first early muzzle loader season opens and the leaves begin to fall the deer head into the thick stuff and go up high for security. They love the cover of the Mountain Laurels around here and spend most of the daylight hours in thick bedding areas and laurel.

The bucks tend to travel downwind of the thick bedding areas and run the ridges hoping to scent a doe, yet stay out of danger/sight as much as possible. First and last light are your productive sitting times…other than that the deer will movement will be pretty slow.

Tree stand sitters get pretty bored this time of year. I tend to hike uphill to be sitting on my stool on one of the above mentioned transition areas, then by 9am I am stillhunting. I’ll try to go right into the bedding areas with the wind in my favor especially if it is breezy to cover my sounds. If I get busted it is all good, if not I may get an opportunity and that has worked out for me. Better than sitting there seeing nothing and freezing! If you find the does you will find the bucks eventually.

Some would gasp and say I am chasing the deer out of the area! I don’t think this is the case around here, but my areas are pressured heavily and I don’t have those old moss horned 4.5 year olds anyhow. The deer have to go somewhere and the pressure is all around….so they will be in a thicket somewhere. Love will make them come around again soon.

If you have a partner you can have them sit on the escape routes while you sneak through the bedding areas also. this has worked well for me if you know the area well.

In short go high and go deep in the thick and find the deer. They learn quick to stay out of sight when the orange appear….patterns change.

Best of luck,

Greg

[Greg Ragan]

in reply to: Making sure they are sharp #45233

No worries, there is no reason why adults cannot have a civil discourse about opposing viewpoints. It is just a shame these conversations are the rarity these days as I think they are the most helpful to gaining a healthy perspective.

Greg8)

[Greg Ragan]

in reply to: Making sure they are sharp #36043

Allow me to retort…

The traditional journey I have been embarking on has evolved. I used to be ultra techno., uber scrutinizing of every single aspect of my “trad” gear and equipment in order to reach the outer possible threshold of “deadliest, most efficient, set up”. That path pulled me right around back into the “techno hunt” that I gave up the wheels for in the first place.

As that realization came to fruition I decided to take a divergent path and continue to simplify not only my gear, but the amount of stress and worry of things which really turn out to be insignificant in the scheme of things.

There is a basic bowhunting tenant, perhaps even considered one of the 10 commandments…..”Thou shalt sharpen thine broadheads to a keen edge”. Obviously I am not arguing against this principle for the killing of the arrow is done with the hemorrhage that results from these flying knives.

…and thank you for the extreme analogy, but no my definition does not include a field point.

I have come to believe all things in the world of archery are a trade-off. I have also learned to steer clear of the extremes.

I began to simplify my gear and tactics. I now hunt with a back quiver, POC wood arrows, and a simple ASL Longbow…..knowing full well other equipment may be more “efficient”…..but does that mean this gear will not kill just as efficiently???

Let us get back on topic now and look at broadheads a moment:

A thinner edge will be sharper, but also perhaps less durable.

Soft metal is easier to sharpen, but perhaps also less durable

A single bevel may add a bit of rotation or penetration, but is all that needed on my hunting weight bow and deer/elk sized targets.

Tool grade high Rockwell steel will hold an edge longer, but does that justify paying 3 or 4 times as much for a head.

A multi blade head will have more cutting area, but then it might be at the penetrations expense.

As I stated it all comes down to what priority the hunter wants to choose at the expense of something else.

Do I think there is a head that is too sharp…..Hell yes I do! The one that can only be acquired by a 110 outlet and a workshop IMO. I would much rather be able to have the ability to sharpen in the woods with only a file. Yes, I do this often. I shoot at a heck of a lot of squirrel, rabbits, and other small game while I am deer hunting and occasionally I’ll miss and bury one in a tree. To me this self-reliance and ability in the field is more appealing and rewarding.

I file sharpen my heads and even intentionally put in serrations with the edge of my file (GASP!)….then re-work the edge back smooth so I have a combination micro-serration/sharp edge. I do this in part because this type of edge will stay effective and durable after passing through tough hide and bone despite the softer steel in my chosen head. Do I have horrible blood trails and lots of lost game????? Nope, stuff is still just as dead and just as quick as before.

I have no use personally for stuff I cannot maintain in the field. Heck if a ceramic broadhead was proven by a PhD physicist as the sharpest, most durable, “Best broadhead on earth” I still wouldn’t spend $30 a piece on it to kill a deer or elk I could make just as dead with a $5 Ace standard. But that’s me.

Everyone must figure out what is sharp enough, fast enough, short enough, heavy enough, expensive enough etc. for them. I am simply sharing there is more than one view on the subject when taken as a whole. My edges are sharp, I’ll be happy to let you examine them and have had great success with them. There is just a point when I refuse to pole vault over mouse turds any longer. It may be human nature but I’m personally done with the overkill analysis and put my excess energy into refining my skill set and enjoying the hunt.

BTW Fred Bear also advocated poison pod broadheads. No thank you!

[Greg Ragan]

in reply to: Making sure they are sharp #56832

If they can cut catch your nail and can cut through rubber bands passed over them with little stretch/pressure they are good to go.

The shaving sharp vs file sharpened debate has been going around for a while. Everyone has their own definition of what is sharp enough.

For me file sharpened (rough file serrations) are good enough and I like to be able to resharpen at will in the field with just a file and not a “system” or a grinder with polishing wheel. Put them where they need to go and they will kill effectively if they are “sharp” enough.

Brings to mind a funny John Schulz quote he had when asked about shaving sharp……He said, “I want to kill’em not shave ’em” 😆

[Greg Ragan]

in reply to: Blood Trails #33318

Lots of factors play into the quantity of blood on the ground….too many variables really.

Here are a few that come to mind:

Fat content of the area hit

Which blood vessels and how many are hit (artery vs veins)

Angle of the impact and skin “play”

Chest cavity, abdomen, or muscle hit

2 holes or one

can organs block one of the holes (back to the shot angle)

Are the holes both high on the animal or low, or combo

shot from trees or on the ground

Is the animal pushed and stressed or allowed to lay down and bed (level of adrenalin

Was the animal jacked up before the shot or did he never even know you were there…..

The point is I don’t think you can count on a good blood trail all the time regardless unless you are shooting the same spot, same angle, same animal…a pretty impossible study and one I don’t think is really needed. The nature is an unpredictable and random thing…part of what we enjoy about it. No matter what you use on the end of your arrow be prepared for whatever the outcome.

Personally I have lots of experience with 4 blade razorheads and eclipse AND more recently 2 blades on animals. I can’t say I can tell a real difference between the 2 styles really….I have lost animals with both and have had 20 yard bloodtrails with both. Even if I had initial better blood with a 4 blade did not mean I recovered more of those animals….If I had less of a trail often the animal died just out of sight. Every situation is unique.

Now, for me I have gone to a 2 blade head because these are my main 3 aspects in a broadhead:

1. durability

2. ease of sharpening and touching up in the field with a file

3. economy

Your priorities may differ…if you are hunting moose or using a 40 pound bow #1 may be penetration…..if you are independently wealthy maybe cost is not a factor….

For all those interested I am shooting Ace standards now and have nothing but confidence in them. Do what Don says…pick one, shoot lots of stuff with it and move on. If you are blaming the broadhead for some failure your probably not looking at the correct root cause anyway….

cheers,

Greg

[Greg Ragan]

in reply to: Re-Thinking old Thoughts on Woodies #26234

Exactly!

They end up just as dead ??

Like Kenny Rogers used to say, “it is the wood that makes it good”!

[Greg Ragan]

in reply to: Re-Thinking old Thoughts on Woodies #21513

After playing with a lot of different woods, I am back to good old POC. I think they are very forgiving fly great and do what I need them to with a regular weighted head. Maybe those old timers figured out something back then and it is just taking me a while to come to the same conclusion. Everything in archery is a trade off….I think POC cut to just above draw length with a 125 or 145 grain 2 blade head is about the most forgiving and balanced shaft I have used…and it has been proving its effectiveness to me on the deer. Hard to find the good stuff anymore but I recently bought some of the older stuff someone had squirreled away and I am impressed.

[Greg Ragan]

in reply to: Deer Calls? Or Just Blowing Hot Air! #21153

Perhaps Grumpy…..but I think I will focus my efforts on my stalking, sneaking, and shooting skills instead. To me carrying more “gear” and being tied to the trees is becoming less desirable. Especially now that I am having increased successes from the ground with minimal gear. I’ll still try out an occasional mouth generated call but I don’t think I’ll be lugging antlers around the woods anymore unless they are attached to the animal I am dragging out.:lol:

[Greg Ragan]

in reply to: Deer Calls? Or Just Blowing Hot Air! #14080

I hunt a lot of pressured areas and animals here. I have tried rattling and calls often but just don’t feel the effort of carrying them justifies them (from my experience). Sure, I have heard of the occasional buck come running but that has not happened for me. I have had some luck with just imitating a grunt with my mouth when a buck was already checking out things nearby….of course that grunt had the buck come in and when he did not see another deer immediately picked me out in the tree and was gone…

So now if a buck is heading away I may try a soft grunt, but I am not too confident it will do much but in that situation whaddyagot to lose…..

I think it all depends on that individual deer and the timing…but to me it is not worth the effort of carrying stuff.

[Greg Ragan]

in reply to: Blood Trails #48364

I think the sharp head has more to do with success than type of broadhead or bevel on deer sized game. I’ve been using ace standards with POC arrows and all 5 deer I’ve shot this year fell within 50 yards. One shot was the femoral (50 yard trail), one was a liver/gut (50 yard trail), one was a spine (dropped), a couple were decent shots to the cage 😳 (both were 25 yard trails!) My point is all were dead within easy yardage of the hit…. AND I was surprised my the internal trauma as well!

One interesting thing I am seeing is my hits from the ground seem to be more lethal then when I was in the tree due to the angle of the trauma:idea: Been grounded by a broken toe lately….

[Greg Ragan]

in reply to: Bob Swinehart #13672

Awesome read but hard to find. I had someone loan me a copy. Worth the wait! Great pics.

[Author]

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