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in reply to: Draw Weight for Deer? #53714
What J.wesbrock said, holds true even more with today’s technology. Modern limb materials and the knowledge concerning optimizing arrow design has made low draw-weight bows even more deadly than ever before.
in reply to: Ultra-EFOC Barely Above The Heavy Bone Threshold #53424sapcut wrote: King,
You may be measuring differently, not wrong but different. I measure the total length to the end of the cut arrow. Not including insert, as per AMO standards in Dr. Ashby’s report.My best so far is 978 gr. and 36.6%. That is 700 gr. up front including aluminum footings. I haven’t tried any heavier. That dude flys great too at 160 fps.
By the sounds of it, I’m guessing it doesn’t really matter how we measure it, as long as we shoot the heaviest weight on the front we can get away with, along with the lightest shaft that will handle it. Add in the right broadhead and super tuning, and you’ll end up with the best penetrating arrow possible with your bow at your draw length.
in reply to: KME website #52706I picked one up at their booth at Denton Hill. Great device! I really liked the tip on using a piece of cardboard for a strop – amazingly simple and effective.
in reply to: Ultra-EFOC Barely Above The Heavy Bone Threshold #52702Hi Ed,
Thanks for the new update. More incredible information on arrow performance! I wish you the best in your recovery.
kingwoudbe, I’m not answering for Ed, but I would guess that you have to build out your rest to get as far away from center-shot as possible. I haven’t tried a UFOC arrow build yet, but when I do it will likely be on a bow that I’m able to move the rest as far from center as I can. I’m also guessing that a weight-forward carbon arrow would be essential.
in reply to: Going to Hunt Elk need some advice #36200Okay, I’ll buck the trend here. The quickest kill on a big game animal that I ever made, was on a mature elk with a 45 lb draw cheap recurve from 1968. I did not use arrows optimized for penetration either. I will say, that you’ll have to be close, accurate and using a very heavy, extreme FOC arrow to up your odds. If you limit your shots and build your arrows correctly, I think you can do it with confidence. I do not believe you will have difficulty fully penetrating the rib cage with the correct arrow if you’re limiting your shots to close range.
in reply to: A Question of Draw Weight #32244Brock63 wrote: I never ever considered having two different weight bows for target and hunting…maybe because I only saw 3D shoots as a way to practice FOR HUNTING later…so I wanted to shoot my hunting setup and take hunting shots no matter the scoring circles…
You really should consider it. I have a 58 lb longbow and a 71 lb one. I shoot them both side by side when practicing. I use the light draw to work on form, I use the heavy one to build holding strength. I end up hunting with both since the practice has made me good with both. My shooting accuracy has gone way up since practicing with both draw weights and my holding strength is good enough from the 71 lb bow, that the 58 lb one feels like I could shoot it the whole day for many hundreds of shots.
in reply to: Experimenting with EFOC is Expensive! #50117Patrick wrote: I’m just saying that the heaviest spined arrow may be over-spined arrow with even the heaviest tips. My set-up is a perfect example of that.
My solution to that has been to keep it as long as possible and add as much weight as needed. Of course, there is a limit to weight that you can add, but I haven’t found that to be a problem. The biggest issue has been finding a carbon shaft that is stiff enough to handle a real heavy tip weight (500-600 gr). I’d like to make a 35-40% FOC arrow, but it requires an incredibly stiff shaft that is still lightweight. At this point, it’s not an off-the-shelf arrow that will achieve that.
in reply to: Experimenting with EFOC is Expensive! #49953Let me take Gold Tip arrows as an example. A 5575 weighs 8.2 gr per inch and is a .400 spine. A 7595 weights 8.9 gr per inch and is a .340 spine. A 30 inch 5575 arrow is only 21 grains lighter than a 7595 arrow of the same length. Yet a 7595 will probably allow me to put at least an extra 100 grains on the tip and end up with the same dynamic spine as the 5575 with a 100 gr less on the tip. In fact, if memory serves me correctly, it’s probably closer to 200 grains. Also, weight on the tip affects FOC far greater than weight distributed along the full length of the shaft. There is relatively little difference in shaft weight on weak spined carbon arrows, vs stiff spined carbon arrow of the same model.
In other words, a 30″ 5575 with the correct tip weight to be shot of of a given bow, will have a lower FOC than a 30″ 7595 with proper tip weight, shot out of the same bow. I hope I said that so it makes sense.
in reply to: Excel Spreadsheet Momentum and KE Calculator #48774Ed, why would someone want to know their KE?
in reply to: Experimenting with EFOC is Expensive! #48768If you want your FOC as high as you can get it, buy the stiffest shaft you can in a lightweight carbon. Keep the shaft as long as possible. There is no reason a shaft has to be cut except to make it stiffer to match a heavy tip weight (assuming you’re not changing your strike plate to something thinner).
Simply load up the tip weight until it matches the dynamic spine of your setup.
in reply to: A Starting Point for EFOC Arrows? #47975Ed Zachary wrote:
Now that is dumfoundingly perfect service!
A big kudos to your brother.I’ll tell him you said so!
What’s really sad, is that the only archers taking advantage are the trad guys. Compound shooters seem to be happy with something somewhat close.
in reply to: A Starting Point for EFOC Arrows? #47547The shop is something he does because he’s loves it. He spends so much time with each customer while setting up their equipment, there is no way he makes much on them. He does have some very faithful customers though. Fortunately, he has another job.
in reply to: A Starting Point for EFOC Arrows? #46670cfiles,
You may want to call around and see if you can find a shop that is experienced with setting up trad bows. It can make it a whole lot easier when getting help from someone who knows what they’re doing. Very few compound-oriented shops will have a clue how to properly spine-tune an arrow and virtually none will have any experience in loading up the tip.
I’m lucky in that my local shop is owned by my brother and we’ve set it up so every arrow he sells has a group that customers can shoot. Each group has arrows cut at 1/2″ increments and they are bareshaft. They already have the heavy inserts installed. So, all the customer has to do is add tip weight and experiment shooting them out of their bow. It usually takes very little time to get one with a heavy tip that is close to proper length. He then cuts them a dozen to a length about 1/2″ longer than what we think it will take and then trim 1/4″ at a time until we have perfect flight from a bareshaft at 25 yards.
in reply to: Shoulder Shots 2 #41920Kingwouldbe wrote:
I understand what your saying Str8arrow, however let’s also not confuse Bowhunting with target archery.Jumping up 15lb will effect most peoples accuracy, it is much better to slowly work up to that weight over the next year
I think I have a pretty good handle on the difference. It’s just that I’d hate to have to limit my shots to 10 yards if I’ve got a bow that allows me to kill at 20 yards.
I use to hunt the Islands off of California, and yes I would sometimes have several shots a day ( wish it was still there ) because you could get ten years of Bowhunting experiences in one, that is so; not the norm.
Wow, what an amazing looking place. If it had an elk population, I just might have to find a way to hunt it.
I am stuck right now with my arrow @ 810 grains with a 28% efoc I can not loud it up any more so my next goal is to get some new shafts and work up a 30%-35% or maybe even a 40% UEFOC arrow.
With those arrows, I’m betting those pigs wouldn’t stand a chance with even a 55 lb draw from with modern limbs. As for a 40% UEFOC arrow, I wish I knew how to build one. I’d love to shoot it.
in reply to: Shoulder Shots 2 #41907My average kill distance (over those last 627 animal, is less than 15 yards (14.97 yards, to be exact). I don’t need pinpoint accuracy at those ranges.
I love your precise statistics! As a whitetail hunter in eastern hardwoods, my average shot distance is much shorter than that – not sure exactly how much :wink:, but my longest shot in 40 years has been 23 yards. However, as an elk hunter, I’ve only had one under 15 yards. They just tend to be in more open areas where you’re not exactly sure where they’ll come through. I definitely put a bigger premium on accuracy when I’m after elk.
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