reflex/deflex

[ChumpMcgee]

#6183

I asked this question roughly a month or so ago and did not get much of a response. I am just curious what is the point of reflex/deflex bows? I understand that recurve bows are shorter but hold the same power. I am just wondering what are the pro’s and con’s of a reflex/deflex bow and why are they better than a traditional straight limb bow?

[Doc Nock]

#48512

since you didn’t get the response you wanted, let a dummie take a shot and see how well I do… 😀

RC I’ve been told stores more energy in the curved limb for a given draw weight…they have wider limbs than LB do, so they tend to be very stable thus transmitting much of the energy stored into the arrow…

Having said that, many of the modern LB bowyers today have experimented with the R/D longbow design, some with composites like carbon and foam core.

My bowyer, bigfoot bows, spent enormous $$ & time testing all sorts of configurations (layups) of varied carbon materials to get the best he can out of a given draw weight.

My LB is 47# and I have to shoot .340 arrows now to get good flight with my EFOC set up.

However, Kirk (Bigfoot) has been working HARD with a static Tip RC and now has them fine tuned where they are delivering incredible efficiency at even lower draw than mine… and they feel very smooth almost like a let off as it reaches anchor.

So, like adult diapers, it DEPENDS! Every bowyer is different, designs vary, testing varies, drive to excel varies and materials vary… but I believe I’m clear that the previously accepted lines between performance on RC and LB have been blurred by modern R/D designs of LB’s and material advances.

Shoot lots of bows, pays your money once. Get what you like best!

[David Petersen]

#48522

T-Roy … I seem to recall providing this answer before, and if it didn’t satisfy then it won’t now. But the simplest way to view it is that the deflex-reflex limb design provides all the same advantages of a recurve but spreads the design through the full limbs rather than just at the tips. Advantages are the same: more speed, less or no hand shock, a shorter bow that’s forgiving, quietness … plus there’s no string slap which can sometimes be a problem with recurves.

I’m sure there are several others here who can explain in more detail, but the above points are the result. In sum, and taking a bit of leeway, I see modern r-d short “longbows” as offering the same advantages as recurves, so it comes down to personal preference in looks, feel, etc. I see no great advantages of either over the other, whereas the diff between a straight or Hill style longbow and a recurve are … well, documented in the tremendous popularity of recurves across recent decades. I shoot a 54″ r/d longbow and no longer even own a recurve. Just my pref.

[ChumpMcgee]

#48531

Thanks Doc and Dave!

I figured that the reflex/deflex shape was to be more like a recurve, to get more power and speed.

You both explained it very well! My mind has been blown thou, I am just thinking now at all the different designs we have for the two types of bows and how we make one to be like the other! I currently have a shorter longbow with a hybrid recurve riser. I love the way the bow shoots the way it feels. So with a hybrid reflex/deflex longbow would it be safe to say that this is a recurve bow with straight limbs?

[Doc Nock]

#48551

In reading Dave’s reply, grip came to mind too…due to my body configuration, I cannot for the life of me shot a straight handled LB or selfbow… had to have a least a partial recurve style grip.

That line is now also blurred since many bowyers will give you RC style grip on a longbow…

Which I believe you just confirmed by calling it a RC riser you now have.

Some of the R/D LB’s will NOT Pass muster at the more serious long bow shoots… they’re not accepting of anything but D shaped bow limbs for LB Class…or so I’m told and read.

ToMAEto or toMAHto! :shock::roll:

[Bruce Smithhammer]

#48563

T-roy wrote: So with a hybrid reflex/deflex longbow would it be safe to say that this is a recurve bow with straight limbs?

Actually, no. You can’t have a recurve with ‘straight’ limbs or else it wouldn’t be a recurve, by definition. In part a recurve is defined, and separated from longbows, by the fact that the string touches the limbs. Also, if it had ‘straight limbs, it wound’t be an r/d bow either.

A reflex-deflex bow is exactly that – it’s one example of a bow in which the string does not touch the limbs, and which by definition, exhibits r/d in the unstrung profile (and possibly the strung profile as well, depending on the degree of r/d). The mere presence of r/d does not dictate a particular length nor handle style, though they tend to be shorter than so-called “English” longbows and often have locator/pistol type grips.

For now, I’ll sidestep the whole debate about whether r/d bows are true “longbows” or not, as much of it really comes down to personal opinion, and (not surprisingly) is often greatly affected by one’s personal bow tendencies. But suffice to say that r/d bows are nothing new at all, and that one of the monikers they have earned – “modern longbows” is inaccurate at best. They are actually a very old design. Even older than Howard Hill…😯

[ChumpMcgee]

#48625

I guess I should have made myself more clear. A longbow with reflex/deflex and a recurve style of riser is basically a recurve incognito.

I guess I need to buy 2 more bows then, 1 recurve and one reflex/deflex longbow then I will see the difference between them 🙂

[Jason Wesbrock]

#48639

The simple answer is that the deflexed riser provides greater stability while the reflexed limbs deliver more energy.

[Bruce Smithhammer]

#48665

I think your original question – “what are the pro’s and con’s of a reflex/deflex bow and why are they better than a traditional straight limb bow?” – has been answered.

T-roy wrote:

A longbow with reflex/deflex and a recurve style of riser is basically a recurve incognito.

With all due respect, I don’t think it’s quite as simple as that. There is a whole spectrum of design that might fall under the term “r/d bow.” It’s true that some of them have quite beefy risers and grips, basically indistinguishable from a typical recurve riser (though they still aren’t recurves). However many r/d bows feature handles that, while they may be more of a locator/pistol-type grip than you’d find on a Hill bow for example, are still much lighter and more slender than what would typically be found on a recurve. The limbs are also going to be more slender and lighter, making for an overall lighter package than a comparable recurve, which many feel is another advantage of an r/d bow.

There are also many nice longbow designs with mild r/d that is hardly noticeable when the bow is strung at all, which I doubt anyone would consider a recurve in hiding.

But when it comes to the 3-piece r/d bows with bolt-on limbs and heavy recurve risers, I personally put those in a class of their own as true “hybrids.”

[ChumpMcgee]

#49428

After what everyone is readings I think I understand it better so thanks everyone. I now will have to decide, when the time comes on what the next bow will be. I have always liked the way the reflex/deflex longbows look now I will have to figure out what bow will pick me 🙂

[Greg Ragan]

#50488

Better is subjective….I prefer the straight limbed bow despite the few feet per second they give up to R/D bows. I like my Hill styles “better”. 8)

[ChumpMcgee]

#50512

two4hooking wrote: Better is subjective….I prefer the straight limbed bow despite the few feet per second they give up to R/D bows. I like my Hill styles “better”. 8)

I like where you are going with that all about personal preference!

[Bruce Smithhammer]

#50571

two4hooking wrote: Better is subjective….

To be fair, in looking back through the responses to the OP’s question, I don’t believe anyone said r/d bows were “better” than anything else. Discussing perceived advantages and/or disadvantages isn’t the same as saying “Bow A is better than Bow B.”

At the end of the day, any bow will get it done, so of course it all comes down to personal preference. The OP got some good advice above that directly pertained to his question. And like he said, the next good thing to do is try a variety of examples and figure out what he likes. 😉

[Greg Ragan]

#50739

T-roy wrote: I asked this question roughly a month or so ago and did not get much of a response. I am just curious what is the point of reflex/deflex bows? I understand that recurve bows are shorter but hold the same power. I am just wondering what are the pro’s and con’s of a reflex/deflex bow and why are they better than a traditional straight limb bow[/size]?

Sorry, you are wrong…..he stated R/D bows are “better”…..

[Bruce Smithhammer]

#50758

two4hooking wrote:

Sorry, you are wrong…..he stated R/D bows are “better”…..

Smithhammer wrote:

To be fair, in looking back through the responses to the OP’s question, I don’t believe anyone said r/d bows were “better” than anything else…

Thanks for pointing that out. I could have been more specific that I was referring to the responses to the OP…

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