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This is my thousandth post here, working hard to be a good boy, so I reckon I’m due a good rant. Story: I went grocery shopping today with my wife, a rare event since she’s a hermit who rarely leaves the cabin. Predictably she soon disappeared into the mob and while waiting for her I was glancing at the covers of bowhunting magazines on the stand when I spotted one that had a blurb something like “Ask our expert about your set-up for elk.” So I opened it to that page and can only say this “expert” is living in a universe having different laws of physics than most of us here are accustomed to. One question was from a shooter who said his deer arrow is carbon with a mechanical broadhead and total weight of 340 grains, shot from a 70-something pound compound. Is this enough for elk, he asked. The expert’s advice was to go to a heavier shaft in order to get the weight up 25 or 30 grains. Wow, that puts him up to a whopping 365-370! For elk! In my books that’s a turkey load, period. Another reader asked about FOC, what it is and how much is best. Our “expert” expertly advised that it’s important but if you get too much it can cause “nose down arrow flight. To avoid a nose dive he recommended sticking with the Eastman guide of 10-15%. And so on. I have been criticized for “getting down on compound shooters” and advised that we should all “live and let live.” In fact I have never looked down on someone for their weapon choice. Rather, what riles me up is the industry and media-shaped compound culture that creates and perpetuates the light-arrow, high-speed, long-shot myth that the hi-tech bowhunting gadget industry feeds on. When killing is our game, and we are rightly being criticized for wounding loss (arrows sticking out of running deer is a particularly common and nasty image where suburban bowhunting is allowed)–when it’s wounded animals and the dignity and future of bowhunting on the line–well, others can live and let live as they wish but I say: “I ain’t gonna take any more!” without critical comment. For hi-tech bowhunters themselves, I mostly just feel sympathy. It’s the profiteers and media-minted “experts” that I find intolerable. Once again, thank goodness for Dr. Ashby, TBM, and truth. Dave
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Dave —
I was wondering what you would do for your 1000th post?
Bravo!! I totally concur – so many { overnight TV } “Expert/ProfessionalHunters, I can’t figure out who is who!?! We Don’t need more hunters, we need “good Hunters”Scout
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Yah I know what you mean. Just today when I was at the range I was getting heckled by a couple of compound shooters because my arrows were 500ish grains (gasp!). At any rate I didn’t bother trying to put the record straight about arrow wieght (they never listen and look at me like I have a third eye).
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It’s a slutty business, hunting is. I bought a climbing treestand this year, first “commercial” purchase in a long time. But I need it for some urban deer hunting. No choice.
Wading through the constant morass of subconscious “now buy this and this and this…” that permeates the hunting market makes me feel like I just walked 5th street at dark.
That said, I believe compound archery is past its prime and will fade away, replaced mostly by xguns. I think we’ll be dreaming about the good old compound days. And if we live long enough, that will fade too.
But the stick and string, humble as it is, will persist. Because it does not fear its true nature, and it brings joy to the heart.
And yet, I don’t go to local shoots anymore because I don’t seem to see the world as the local trad archers do either. Everything is viewed through the lens of employment. I think Aldo L. commented to that effect once, that a man’s truth is largely controlled by who writes his paycheck. So we all fall to the same sluty need for “growth” that drives the compound industry. And is killing our planet.
I’m just thankful that I can stay on my humble homestead and grow/hunt my food.
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David Petersen wrote: Another reader asked about FOC, what it is and how much is best. Our “expert” expertly advised that it’s important but if you get too much it can cause “nose down arrow flight. To avoid a nose dive he recommended sticking with the Eastman guide of 10-15%.
There’s an “expert” giving advice on something he’s obviously never even tried. I want to see anyone make a tuned, horizontally launched EFOC or Ultra-EFOC fly with a “nose down” attitude. That defies the laws of physics.
I share your outrage at all the deliberately promulgated misinformation, Dave. Well said, sir.
Ed
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Dr. Ed Ashby wrote: There’s an “expert” giving advice on something he’s obviously never even tried.
That is SO typical of people in general. So many people like to give advice, and even scarier, are taken as experts, without really knowing what they are talking about. It drives me to drink. 👿
Well, the last part isn’t really true, but it’s an excellent excuse. 😉
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“In the beginner’s mind there are many possibilities. In the ‘expert’s’ mind there are few….”
– Lao Tzu
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Dave,
One thousand post! Thank you for your passion and insite. Being new to hunting, and trying to take my first deer with my Fathers bow is a wonderful ride. My Father passed away a few years ago. Learning to shoot his bow connects me to him. My brother-in-law wants me to switch over to compounds, like he shoots, to make it “fair” to the deer. I’m having a hard time trying to get him to understand there is more to this than “just the kill”. Deer have been taken with traditional bows for a lot longer than they have with the wheels. I love the simplicity and the feel of the recurve in my hand. I guess the only way to show him is to take a deer with the recurve. Thanks again for your passion .
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Well put, Steve.
Great quote, Bruce. Where’d you find that? 😛
Jaybuzzard — You gotta watch out for those brothers-in-law, an infamously shady lot of ne’er-do-wells. I envy you your connection with a bowhunting father. All my dad enjoyed was work and worry. And now, he’s just as dead as if he’d made a good time of his life and mine. -
David Petersen wrote: Rather, what riles me up is the industry and media-shaped compound culture that creates and perpetuates the light-arrow, high-speed, long-shot myth that the hi-tech bowhunting gadget industry feeds on. Dave
+1 Boy, that’s it in a nutshell. I also don’t agree with the “light is right” crowd. One pin shooting, we don’t need to practice as much, thus it must be better, etc, etc. They sure kill a lot of paper, wound a lot of everything else. JMHO
Good 1,000th Dave – Good that you got to it before hunting season arrived.:)
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Fine post. Love a good rant. I don’t have any experience on light arrows on game or heavy for that matter, as I’m just getting started. However… I’ve upped my arrow weight on the front end and the only downside I see so far is that I’m having a harder time getting my judos out of the stumps.
The information I find here and in books by, mostly, Dave and Fred, has helped me quite a lot. Dr. Ashby’s information is a constant source of interest. I appreciate your guidance.
Congratulations on your Millennial post, good for the next generation, as it was for the last! -
Well I’ll be…. Yesterday I had as much the same thing told to me. I was at a tournament in SW OH. After I finished I was sitting inside talking to three fellows I’d never met. One noticed my footings on my carbon shafts as well as the small A&A fletching and ask about them. As I started telling him about the arrows one of the other fellows commited along the lines of ” I’d never shoot an arrow that heavy, speed will take care of everything you have to worry about”.
OK…… he didn’t just say that?????
Being the open mouth I’m often know for I stated “well if speed is all your worried about, then why in the heck are you shooting a longbow instead of a compound”.
His responce was “well I just play around with stickbows, but would never hunt with one”.
No,no, no, he didn’t say that either…
Here we go again,,,, as usual I said the first thing that came to my mind…. “I’m Sorry”….
His reply was, “what you mean by that”…
Lord help me I couldn’t resist and stated ” You wouldn’t understand”…
Oh well,,,, he just turned and walked away. The other two laughed and then stated they wished I’d done that earlier. Seemed he was one of those that always thought his way was the only way and had a bad habit of inviting himself into everything they wanted to do…
Can’t say I did bad or good… Really don’t care.
Troy
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I have some pig arrows that I made with purple heart shafts and 190 Grizzlys that weigh over 1100 grains. I wonder what the 350 gr Elk Expert would think of those?
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Whoaaaaaaaaa!!!!! 1100grs:shock:
Dad gum,,, don’t shoot him with it,, just drop it on him:P
Troy
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I went down to the local sporting goods store yesterday to purchase my Scout leader uniform and was surprised to see the “female” mannequin holding a recurve and wearing a side pack/quiver. Very techy looking, but a recurve none the less….
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Wow, I can’t wait to get my Christmas Cabelas Catalogue! I’m drooling over the new Compound bows and Cross-bows and mechanicals.:twisted:
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