Heavy grain broadheads

[qsmith]

#5750

I am trying to develop a great hunting arrow setup. I have just read over most of Dr. Ashby’s material that is on this site, great stuff! I am curious how broadheads that are “heavy” affect arrow flight.

Right now I shoot 125 grain broadheads on carbon shafts and have them tuned fairly well to my bow. What kind of adjustments will I need to make if I move to a broadhead such as the tuffhead at 225 grains? Is this even a good idea to do? What do you think?

[Bruce Smithhammer]

#44195

I definitely think it’s a good idea. Anymore, it’s hard for me to imagine shooting anything less than a 250 gr. point for larger game (and even that seems a little on the light side). What will you be hunting?

With a correctly matched spine, they should fly great (maybe even better), but they will certainly give you much better penetration.

[qsmith]

#44220

I will be mostly hunting white-tail deer and mule deer. I would like to use a set up that I can take with me if I graduate to some bigger challenges like elk or bear though.

[David Petersen]

#44400

Man, I’m getting deja vu on this one. Anyhow I agree with Smithhammer. Heavier heads make an arrow fly better and penetrate better and kill better. I’m currently shooting the 225 Tuffhead with 125 steel adapter and 100 grain brass insert on CE 250 shafts for a total arrow weight of 691. This much weight and FOC is not necessary for whitetails but in my books is necessary for clean kills on elk every time, and as we Ashby disciples like to say, There is no such thing as overkill in an arrow set-up. I am currently awaiting the forthcoming 300-grain Tuffhead. I find that my arrow trajectory, thus accuracy out to 20 yards or so, doesn’t change until I get closer to 800 grains. I’d shoot for a total weight around 650 with 20% or better FOC and a good single-bevel two-blade and you’ll kill whitetails like clockwork and also be ready for elk … unless you’re trying to do it with less than 50 pounds draw weight. My 2 scents. dp

[Troy Breeding]

#44974

qsmith wrote:

I am trying to develop a great hunting arrow setup. I have just read over most of Dr. Ashby’s material that is on this site, great stuff! I am curious how broadheads that are “heavy” affect arrow flight.

Right now I shoot 125 grain broadheads on carbon shafts and have them tuned fairly well to my bow. What kind of adjustments will I need to make if I move to a broadhead such as the tuffhead at 225 grains? Is this even a good idea to do? What do you think?

To answer your question adjustments. Most likely you will have to shorten your shafts. Adding 100grs to the front of your arrow will cause the dynamic spine to weaken.

I’d suggest bareshafting with both heads. The difference will show.

Troy

[Steve Sr.]

#44990

David Petersen wrote: Man, I’m getting deja vu on this one. Anyhow I agree with Smithhammer. Heavier heads make an arrow fly better and penetrate better and kill better. I’m currently shooting the 225 Tuffhead with 125 steel adapter and 100 grain brass insert on CE 250 shafts for a total arrow weight of 691. This much weight and FOC is not necessary for whitetails but in my books is necessary for clean kills on elk every time, and as we Ashby disciples like to say, There is no such thing as overkill in an arrow set-up. I am currently awaiting the forthcoming 300-grain Tuffhead. I find that my arrow trajectory, thus accuracy out to 20 yards or so, doesn’t change until I get closer to 800 grains. I’d shoot for a total weight around 650 with 20% or better FOC and a good single-bevel two-blade and you’ll kill whitetails like clockwork and also be ready for elk … unless you’re trying to do it with less than 50 pounds draw weight. My 2 scents. dp

ME TOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! (well not WAITING…..still hunting LOL)

God Bless……

[Vintage Archer]

#44996

Switching to a heavy arrows and /or EFOC requires a comment in time,effort and some times expense.It is very seldom one can add 100 grains up front of their arrow with out a spine change.Hopefully shortening the arrow as suggested, if possible, will suffice other wise you will have to experiment with different arrows thus the expense.

In my opinion the effort and possibly expense is well worth it for the reasons described by others .

If shooting instinctively you should stay committed to that set up for all archery practice.I often here archers comment that they use lighter arrows for 3D .If you you use the heavy set up all the time shooting reasonable distances is not a problem as Dave P.described in his post.

Good luck and have fun!I am sure if you switch you will never look back unless it is to reflect why you did not switch sooner.

[jmsmithy]

#45417

Hey Q

My first experience w/ raising head weight was few years back, before my Trad epiphany. I was still shooting wheelbows and was heading to my next Alaska excursion, first for Brownies. Told Outfitter my setup and he said all is fine EXCEPT go from 100 to 125 gr head. My groups (which were good to begin with at 50yds) immediatley tightened, doing nothing else.

Once I saw the light and went to recurve, I began reading everything I could, found this forum as well as Dave Peterson, Ed Ashby, and host of folks here on this site (some who have answered you already – Steve, Troy, S Hammer, Joe…)

I figured grains per inch arrow weight for my bow (62″ Black Widow PMA II 50lbs @ 28″) and played with all kinds of heads. For me, ABS Ashby’s flying beautifully. They are 315gr, which, initially having shot compounds for 30yrs, seemed ridiculous UNTIL I learned about FOC and EFOC arrow setups.

Read everything…shoot everything you can – a lot…listen to these guys…they really know their stuff. Good luck and have fun.

JM >>>–>>

[qsmith]

#45579

Wow! Thank you for the response everyone! I am sure you do get a lot of repeat questions from beginners as Dave and Steve mentioned. I would just like to express my thanks for everyone taking the time to explain things that may seem simple or obvious to you now. So far to me, my discovery of traditional archery is like finding the Holy Grail! I am fascinated by every aspect of it.

I really appreciate all of the help. As for shortening my arrows……….I really want to move away from carbon and start shooting wood arrows. My arrow length right now is 31″ though. I have been told that is the maximum length I can obtain on a wood shaft. Is this true? If it is, then to fix the problem of having weaker spine with heavier points, shouldn’t I just try a heavier spined shaft to begin with?

I shoot a 55# Bear Grizzly recurve bow. My actual draw weight is 60# at 30″ I am going to try 75-80 spine cedar shafts to start out. Sound good?

[qsmith]

#45580

[Vintage Archer]

#45668

G……

I will make a stab at answering your question. I am sure others will chime in even with contrasting ideas. I think that the first step in the decision process will be to determine what your goal is. Do you want a high FOC arrow or do you want a heavy arrow .Or do you want to try both heavy arrow and EFOC

I shoot a 55# Bear Grizzly recurve bow. My actual draw weight is 60# at 30″ I am going to try 75-80 spine cedar shafts to start out. Sound good?

If you are striving for a UEFOC arrow it will be hard to obtain that with wood arrows as the options to add a lot of weight up front are limited to the tip and possibly an add on such as woody weights. For UEFOC you need carbon arrows

If you just want a heavy wood arrow than you might give consideration to woods other than cedar..There are many you could investigate.

If you are striving for a wood arrow in the range that Dave mentioned “650 grain and 20% + FOC than cedar may work .It will depend on the weight combo (arrow+tip) .

You could go for both weight and EFOC by using a cedar arrow and as much weight as you can get glued to the front getting the FOC in the mid 20%

Which arrow material you decide on wood ,carbon or aluminum I would recommend that you strive to obtain at least a total weight of 650 grains total arrow weight .Dr ED Ashby has gleaned from his studies that the threshold to obtain bone penetration is 650 grains and higher. FOC or weight up front does not help in bone penetration but does out perform in soft tissue. However an arrow that exceeds 650 grain total weight and the FOC is exceeding 20%+ would be ideal. A very good place to start.

To answer more directly you question if you use cedar arrows in the 75 to 80 range they probably weigh in around 400 to 500grains(guess) I have no idea if the spine would work it will depend on the weight up front. You could be over or under spine .Sometimes you can purchase samples of arrows of different spines for experimentation.

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