atv riding

[turtlebunting]

#6694

i love bowhunting with my longbow been doing it for about 8 years now!…. but i also like atv riding with me son and friends! there been alot talk about ppl on this site in this mag that dont like atvs on public land!! i think its great thing to ride where u hunt… but it should be legal to ride there! not just go out on public land and tear everything up! and ppl should stay on the trails and not get off them ..which alot ppl do and dont do!!! i think there should be public land just for atving and trucking and they should have to by tags every year just like hunters do. i do agree with ppl abuse the public land with atvs.
what im tryn to say is that not atv riders are bad. and to be total honest the views on this topic has kinda keep me away from this site!!!!!!!! BUT NOT THE MAG! ITS THE BEST MAG OUT TODAY!!!!! BE SAFE

[paleoman]

#54200

Speaking for myself, you won’t convince me to join a lovefest for atv’ers. If I was a native American and the whites came in on ATV’s, I’d sneak up on them in camp, slash the fuel line and tomahawk the tanks!

[chainsaw]

#54295

Most of the ATV behavior I have witnessed during elk and deer season leaves much to desired. Total disregard for road closures, pioneering of new road systems have ruined hunts for those of us on foot/horsback. IMO they should be banned from NF/BLM ground during hunting season.

[T Downing]

#54335

Turtlebunting, Good morning. I have to respectfully disagree with you. Out here in the west, the rise of ATV use and abuse has been like a spread of a virus. I agree with Chainsaw completely when He suggests that they should be banned from National forests and BLM land during hunting season. I don’t even really have an issue with the OHV crowd as much as I do with hunters who insist that the ATV is necessary equipment while hunting season is on. Some of the abuses that I have personally witnessed: Cutting fences to trespass on private land, going off road into Roadless areas, retrieving game on an established trail that has been designated for hiking/horse use only. And this crime was done by five hunters who knew that they couldn’t take ATV’s into the Roadless area and they punked out and went in anyway. God forbid that they could have taken out the elk in one trip with backpacks! Sir, I respect your opinions on the subject, especially if you are one of the few ATV hunter users who conducts themselves legally. I just ask you to respect my thoughts on it as well. Many of us who occupy this site love wild places and are outspoken advocates of protecting wild places and the animals that live there. The ATV is a complete intrusion into this mindset. Or what I deem the “land ethic”. I want to walk into the National Forest or Wilderness Area with longbow in hand, listening to the most beautiful sounds of the woods. I want to hear the haunting bugle of the bull elk, the wheeze of a spooked deer, the symphony of wild birds awakening to the morning light. The ATV destroys this beauty and wonder. I will not claim that I know what it is like in Illinois where you live, and again, I respect the right to your opinion but for this westerner, ATV’s and hunting do not belong in the same sentence. God bless, T

[wahoo]

#54601

T hit it right on the head. Thank you . In the west and I am sure every where ATVs are , it’s a night mare . They are I believe the biggest threat to the way we hunt and our public lands . This year in Idaho they finally came out with a map and they marked all rds but still folks drive any where they like and I still haven’t seen any fines. Not only do people drive all over the place but the garbage they leave behind is a disgrace . I am with T on this . I give ATVs a big thumbs down.

[turtlebunting]

#54834

i dont know were to start and i hope this make sense i had along day work. in IL its illegal to ride a atv anywhere not unless u have a handle cap sticker u got to go toa doctor and get it like u do those crappy crossbows. if ur caught 700 dolars fine and they take ur atv most of the time. IL use not care i beleive in the early ninties they pass this laws that back when they logged out shawnee forest. they stop them both about the sametime.

i ppl still abuse it but state cut back on game warden ther 1 for to counties now? and when u seen these ppl riding where they are not post to be did u call the law if u didnt ur just as much to blame as they are!

im not real sure about that indain guy but u chop a gas tank tomahawk it might blow up and kill everyone alround…. pretty good debate… be safe

[wahoo]

#54953

I believe that some states back east have or are trying to get a handle on the atv situation but in the west it’s a mess. Don’t kid yourself we have hundreds of miles in the forest all on public land you could ride for months and not cover all the access that is open . You can hunt all day long with an atv it’s just that there is a bunch of folks that are fed up with the abuse. The animals here even hate them. Folks don’t know but you can be watching a herd of elk or deer and a atv can be coming up the road and you can watch these herds pack up and head out of the country.Just makes me walk farther.

[chainsaw]

#55314

Idaho Fish and Game has been trying to get a handle on it but I find that when I report illegal activity the buck gets passed between Fish and Game and the Forest Circus. Nobody really wants to enforce the law. Now I hear one of our state lawmakers from the Boise area wants to nullify any attempts by Fish and Game to control ATVs.

Bottom line ATVs are big business in the West. During big game seasons in Idaho it is rare to see a pickup heading to the hills without an ATV in the bed or more commonly towing a trailer full of them. Its like an invasion of mechanized infantry. Manufacturers, dealers and the Blue Ribbon Coalition combine into a fairly powerful lobby.

Most people are opportunists and will use whatever method that makes killing game easier. ATVs, game cameras, inline muzzleloaders, compound bows, rifle/scopecombos that enable the shooter to dial in and make 700-800 yard kills. Throw into the mix a bunch of cuddly wolves from and the result will be less opportunity for our kids.

[Brian Halbleib]

#55346

I do not own an ATV and have nothing against them when they are used properly and in areas designated for them. The sense of entitlement of some of the riders is what drives me crazy. I bought an abandoned farm in Ohio that was polluted with ATV tracks. I was fortunate to get it under control fast with posted signs and blocking access and the strict trespassing laws in Ohio have kept them at bay.

As a law enforcement officer in rural Pennsylvania, I deal with a lot of ATV trespassing. I can’t tell you how many parents of these riders, who live on postage stamp lots, get upset that a landowner doesn’t want their kid riding on their property. They say they’re not hurting anything. I always ask how long it would take them to call the police if someone was riding an ATV on their front lawn….

-Brian

[Bruce Smithhammer]

#55380

I’d have to second the opinions of the other Western contributors on here.

It’s astounding, and sad, to me how quickly the ATV has come to be seen as “essential” for hunting. There are literally tons of people who can’t imagine going hunting without one anymore, where only a few decades ago, they would have had to walk or go on horseback.

Whether I personally agree with ATV use in the backcountry or not, I recognize that there are lots of responsible ATV users. But far too many aren’t – they are tearing the hell out of the backcountry and feel it is their God-given right to do so, and that any attempt to limit that is a sign of “oppressive government.” This is ludicrous – the attitude that one should be able to go wherever they want in the backcountry on a motorized vehicle, and tear the hell out of our public lands, is the height of juvenile, selfish, me-first mentality.

And don’t even get me started on when I hear these folks complaining that they’re not seeing any game….

True story: A few years back there were a couple FS roads near my house that were getting torn to hell by ATV’s, and had been for years. The FS announced that they were closing those roads to non-motorized traffic. There were still tons of other access roads in this mountain range for ATVs to use, but closing off these two resulted, literally, in multiple death threats against our local FS office.

Death threats?!? Simply because the FS was slightly limiting access, as a result of years of irresponsible ATV behavior? Because these folks have become that reliant on a mode of transportation they didn’t even have just a couple decades ago?!? Pathetic.

If you feel the same way, support BHA.

[johntribett]

#55533

I also agree with the majority here. I work in CO 3 months a year and the abuse is unbelievable.
This past season My boss and myself were driveing up a FS road with 2 clients. As we approached a curve in the rd an atv came flying around the curve and slammed into the side of his truck. How the guy stepped away unhurt still amazes me. An idiot for sure. A few weeks after that I was riding up a different FS road packing clients into base camp when I heard an atv head down towards us. I stopped ASAP and got everyone to the far side of the rd. This moron came blowing by us and our horses spooking the heck out of everyone. If I hadn’t moved everyone to the side he would’ve most certainly plowed into someone.
I’m also amazed at how people here where I live “have” to use them when the biggest piece of land they hunt might crack 200 acres.
Sorry for the long post but I figured examples would clarify my why I despise ATVs.
JT

[turtlebunting]

#56489

when i go hunting i dont use my atv i walk. the way i look at it i dont want mess my hunt up. that way i think should be a land set aside just for atv riding. they have to buy tags every year. thats what illinois did. if they ride where there not post to be they should get tickets.

[turtlebunting]

#56498

Smithhammer wrote: I’d have to second the opinions of the other Western contributors on here.

It’s astounding, and sad, to me how quickly the ATV has come to be seen as “essential” for hunting. There are literally tons of people who can’t imagine going hunting without one anymore, where only a few decades ago, they would have had to walk or go on horseback.

Whether I personally agree with ATV use in the backcountry or not, I recognize that there are lots of responsible ATV users. But far too many aren’t – they are tearing the hell out of the backcountry and feel it is their God-given right to do so, and that any attempt to limit that is a sign of “oppressive government.” This is ludicrous – the attitude that one should be able to go wherever they want in the backcountry on a motorized vehicle, and tear the hell out of our public lands, is the height of juvenile, selfish, me-first mentality.

And don’t even get me started on when I hear these folks complaining that they’re not seeing any game….

True story: A few years back there were a couple FS roads near my house that were getting torn to hell by ATV’s, and had been for years. The FS announced that they were closing those roads to non-motorized traffic. There were still tons of other access roads in this mountain range for ATVs to use, but closing off these two resulted, literally, in multiple death threats against our local FS office.

Death threats?!? Simply because the FS was slightly limiting access, as a result of years of irresponsible ATV behavior? Because these folks have become that reliant on a mode of transportation they didn’t even have just a couple decades ago?!? Pathetic.

If you feel the same way, support BHA.

death threats!!!! why r ppl like that…stuff like let another reason to close pubic land. those r expensive to keep fix. and there are alot just atv parks and truck park just for riding, mudding, camping. and they keep up with trails. i still cant believe about the death threats….

[strait-aero]

#56562

I applaud Jason for being a responsible atv’er and not using his for hunting. We can’t condemn someone for owning one. He’s hunting the challenging way that all of us on this site are trying to maintain in a world of “quicker and easier”. Give a brother some credit and encouragement! Wayne

[turtlebunting]

#56591

i know what great about this site!!!!! no one use cuss words or called and names… we all good ppl one here!!!! look at this pic of my boy if i can get it loaded…. he found a big stick down in the creek and he thoguht he was mr.bigdog sitin on the atv by himself!!!!!!!

[sagebrush]

#56666

I own a Rokon. I use it responsibly. I shot two elk last year and packed them out on my back. What’s funny, I also hate what atvs are doing in the backcountry.Gary

[WICanner]

#56692

I have a Polaris Ranger that I use around my property here in WI. They are great tools here for cutting wood, mending fence, etc. But I leave it at home when going out west. My experience has been that they are of no benefit when they scare game and irritate others. I know the feeling of having one pass you on a closed trail, and how they get abused in the back country. Like so many things, it boils down to the user, but it is also one of those things most frequently abused. ‘Tread lightly’ really isn’t in the ATV glossary of terms for out west on public land. Unfortunate, but the outlaws will ruin it for many, riders and non-riders alike.

[Patrick]

#56843

This subject has been beaten to death. I don’t quite follow the line of reasoning here. I’m not going to get into a discussion regarding regulating ATV’s or the such. However, I really despise their use for hunting, and don’t quite see how they fit into traditional bowhunting. When I’m hunting, (or hiking, for that matter) I want to hear nature, not a distant ATV rumbling along…amongst other reasons.

[turtlebunting]

#56967

WIcanner wrote: I have a Polaris Ranger that I use around my property here in WI. They are great tools here for cutting wood, mending fence, etc. But I leave it at home when going out west. My experience has been that they are of no benefit when they scare game and irritate others. I know the feeling of having one pass you on a closed trail, and how they get abused in the back country. Like so many things, it boils down to the user, but it is also one of those things most frequently abused. ‘Tread lightly’ really isn’t in the ATV glossary of terms for out west on public land. Unfortunate, but the outlaws will ruin it for many, riders and non-riders alike.

they are great tools and fun to drive too… bad things about other ppl on here use them too…just decide not post anything. i hope im not a outlaw in traditional bowhunting communtyfor being a riding my at on privite land where i got permission and atv parks…but when i go deer hunting i walk and drag it out when i do kill something

[bruc]

#57483

No you ‘re not alone turtle! I have one and have had it for about five years. We have an acreage, it gets used for hauling firewood, hauling leaves from our yard and so on.
It also gets used to haul the odd animal out of the bush!
The people I know that ride them “crazy and aggressive” are a little “different breed” !! Most of them don’t hunt and the few that do aren’t that good at it!
For me instead of recreational riding on an atv. Strapping on snowshoes, x-country skis, or just plain walking are a lot healthier and enjoyable. A lot cheaper too 😉
Bruce

[Frank H V]

#58734

Well guess I’ll jump in with my .02 & probably get blasted for it.
I’m really against those who ride ATVs & make new roads, go as fast as they can throwing dust all over anyone else in the area, being obnoxious about their riding, & just generally tearing up the hills with them.
That said some of us have reached the age where we can’t hike 5 miles in rugged terrain, or pack an Elk out if we did. Some of us ride responsibly & don’t pretend we are constantly in a race, We’ll yeild to other traffic, foot, horses, or vehicular. I would also turn in an ATV rider who is violating those road closures & testify if needed. I’ve owned horses for over 40 years so I know what a roaring machine can do to spook them. I don’t have horses now because I’d have to board one out & all the other costs Horsemen know goes with them.
We don’t make new roads where there wasn’t one before, & respect USFS closures, even when they close roads that heve been there for 50 years or more. My personal feelings are that we have ENOUGH wilderness lands & more only further restricts those of us who are no longer physically able to hike the long hikes on foot, but who still enjoy getting out into the hills. I use my ATV to get me close to where I can walk, not to hunt off of.
OK I’ve given my feelings So blast away. But there are some of us still able to hunt & enjoy the outdoors who can’t hike like we used to & don’t want the expense of a Horse that’ll be used sparingly during the year.
Thanks Frank

[johntribett]

#58769

H V,
You’ll get no blasting from me.
Your response was very well put and I have loads of respect for your way of thinking.
I feel for you and understand where you’re coming from 100%.
In all actuality it’s people like yourself that are the most adversly affected by the actions of the huge majority of ATV riders (based soley on my experiences with them).
It’s not the ATV thats the problem it’s the owners and their seemingly universal way of thinking. It’s a shame all ATV riders aren’t like you.
JT

[Frank H V]

#58774

johntribett wrote: H V,
You’ll get no blasting from me.
Your response was very well put and I have loads of respect for your way of thinking.
I feel for you and understand where you’re coming from 100%.
In all actuality it’s people like yourself that are the most adversly affected by the actions of the huge majority of ATV riders (based soley on my experiences with them).
It’s not the ATV thats the problem it’s the owners and their seemingly universal way of thinking. It’s a shame all ATV riders aren’t like you.
JT

JT, thanks, I’m appaled at the way some of the riders ride. It does give all of us a bad name. I see ads on the TV for ATVs & none of the ones I’ve seen have the riders going slowly enjoying the scenery. They are all going as fast as they can throwing up dust trails a hundred yards long. It’s sickening.
Frank

[Bruce Smithhammer]

#58809

It’s good to hear from some responsible riders out there, and as I said above, I have no problem with folks who are riding legally and responsibly in places where it is ok to do so, with an awareness for impact on others. I own a dual-sport bike and have certainly been know to explore a dirt road now and then.

Two additional thoughts:

– Responsible riders need to start doing more to reign in the “out of control” segment of their user group, or all motorized users are going to suffer the consequences. These limitations and closures often see blame shifted to “environmentalists” or “the damn federal government” or “fill in the blank,” but this is usually not truly the case. Loss of access and limitations of use lie first and foremost with irresponsible users and the impacts they create. If you are a responsible user, please get involved in educating others about responsible motorized conduct in the backcountry, whether formally or informally or both.

– I sympathize with those who are, for whatever reason, physically unable to get into the backcountry without motorized assistance. I really do. But responsible use or not, there need to continue to be places – LARGE places – where ATV’s simply are not allowed to go. Even responsible users still create impact in terms of noise and presence. I have a hard time with an ORV lobby that seeks to justify being able to go anywhere they desire, and that views any impingement to that access as an affront to their “freedoms.” Tearing up public lands, and creating more roads where they are not needed by anyone besides one user group, is not a demonstration of “freedom” in my opinion, it’s a demonstration of not caring about your impacts on anyone else.

[David Petersen]

#58873

What an excellent, level-headed, informed and polite discussion of one of the meanest topics in hunting today. I agree with most everything most everyone says, on both sides. Here are a few points for further consideration, drawn from many years of personally, publicly, and professionally being deeply involved in ORV issues in the West:
Most folks who like and defend ATV use are not from the West and have not experienced the outragous problems on our public, Forest Service and BLM lands. I too think an ATV would beat the heck out of horse for ranch and farm work, and I say do what you like on your own private property. This is overwhelmingly a western public lands issue and like Vietnam vets often find themselves saying, “You’d just have to of been there to understand.”
Granted there are many great wonderful folks who love to ride ATVs. But it’s not merely an Abuse problem; it’s also an over-use problem and your personal ethics and riding habits don’t keep you from being a statistic, another motorized vehicle where there already are far too many.
I am 64 and full of age-related aches and pains but still hunt on foot and pack my meat on my back and find that a large part of the fun, though it doesn’t always seem so at the time. When I get too old to trad bowhunt the way I always have and the only way I want to, I won’t switch to training wheels either on a bow or an ORV. If a person is relatively young and seriously disabled, say from a war wound, car accident, birth defect, etc., they should be allow to ride an ATV off-road within reason, but still not to the point that it disturbs wildlife, destroys habitat or disrupts enjoyment for nonmotorized users. But I don’t buy the argument that we all are entitled to get into the backcountry on wheels and motors simply because we’ve become too old, or prematurely out of shape. As another poster said, this “entitlement” concept that’s so dear to motorized users is out of control and not a good sign for the collective American spirit.

So long as ORVs are allowed to operate off established system roads on public lands, esp. during big game seasons, the problems will only continue to grow.

Thanks again for such a dignified discussion and I hope I haven’t poisoned it in any way. Dave p

Thanks

[johntribett]

#58916

Dave,
You’ve not poisoned this discussion what so ever as I see it.
As a matter of fact your response is more like an injection of enlightenment then a bite from a rattler.
I agree, sadly, that the problem is only going to grow.
JT

[Frank H V]

#59158

Dave just mentioned the largest misuse of ATVs or any motorised vehicle. OFF ESTABLISHED ROADS! I’m 115% with him on that. Any motor vehicle should stay on established roads unless it’s an emergency vehicle doing a rescue.
Frank

[stalkin4elk]

#59207

Lets all relax and talk politics awhile!:lol::lol::lol:

[celinsin]

#64057

David Petersen wrote: As another poster said, this “entitlement” concept that’s so dear to motorized users is out of control and not a good sign for the collective American spirit.

I applaud Dave’s insightful comments – especially the one cited above regarding entitlement. Where I live with my family in rural Applachia, this overwhelming sense of entitlement regarding ATV abuse has spoiled more hunts than I care to mention. In addition, ATV riders racing past my home have on several occasions come close to harming my children and animals. 👿

I’m glad to note from this discussion that responsible and respectful ATV riders do exist … I’ve just not seen many where I reside. Of course, my state reportedly leads the nation in ATV-related injuries and fatalities.

Later, Chris

[Bruce Smithhammer]

#33585

Not going to preach or debate this further – it’s been discussed enough.

All I’ll say is that if you care about continuing to have non-motorized, traditional hunting in Idaho, there are two bills before the state senate right now that would potentially strip that status from almost 1/3 of the current, non-motorized hunting units in the state.

The bills would also strip the Idaho Department of Fish and Game of the authority to regulate the use of off-road vehicles as “aids to hunting.”

If this concerns you, please go here and make your voice heard.

[Stumpkiller]

#33630

. . . not just go out on public land and tear everything up! and ppl should stay on the trails and not get off them ..which alot ppl do and dont do!!!

Unfortunately, one ATV rider can screw up the land for dozens of years in a few hours. As a landowner I forbid them on my property. Gun hunters, OK. Compound shooters, OK (one even took “my” nine-point two years ago with a compound & my blessings afterward). But no ATV riding. Some have spoiled it for all. Gates open, muddy ruts that change drainage patterns, noise. I have a powerline right-of-way that I can’t do much about unless I am there.

I used to hunt 3,600 acres that was public access. I’d get up three hours before sunrise. Drive to the area and walk in to be in place and quiet for an hour before sun up. About 5 minutes before legal light there’d be an engine and some bozo would park his ATV near me and walk another 100 yards and sit down. Happened many times. Nothing steams a fellow more than that. What I eventually learned to do was “pattern” the lazy hunters and put myself where there was no vehicle access in the thick stuff where the deer moved to, so I considered them just a noisy nuisance.

My “ATV” is a 1956 Ford 640 tractor. I keep it to about 2 mph while in the woods. I still drag my deer as far as it takes to get them to an existing logging road where I can use the tractor.

What you do on your own land is your business. What you do on public land is everyone’s business. Some folks can’t be trusted with stewardship of a damageable resource.

[Bruce Smithhammer]

#33654

Stumpkiller wrote:

What you do on your own land is your business. What you do on public land is everyone’s business. Some folks can’t be trusted with stewardship of a damageable resource.

Well said.

And that’s one sweet Ford.

[bruc]

#34007

That is one sweet Ford:wink:
I like the deer carry! Wish I had one!

Bruce

[Hiram]

#34224

What an excellent, level-headed, informed and polite discussion of one of the meanest topics in hunting today. I agree with most everything most everyone says, on both sides. Here are a few points for further consideration, drawn from many years of personally, publicly, and professionally being deeply involved in ORV issues in the West:
Most folks who like and defend ATV use are not from the West and have not experienced the outragous problems on our public, Forest Service and BLM lands. I too think an ATV would beat the heck out of horse for ranch and farm work, and I say do what you like on your own private property. This is overwhelmingly a western public lands issue and like Vietnam vets often find themselves saying, “You’d just have to of been there to understand.”
Amen Dave!!, and amen.:)

Yes! I have witnessed it firsthand two years ago. I used to hunt Missionary Ridge in Colorado. Dave knows exactly where I was camped on Canyon Creek below Henderson lake. I was to Bowhunt only, and it was during Muzzle loader season. They were everywhere!!!!!ATV’s with slobs running in the prohibited areas. I left! I have never returned to this area. I now have to hunt DEEP, in an area I found with no slobs on ATV’S. I own one myself!It has no use in Colorado on Public land. I use it as a farm/work implement and to run my Dogs for exercise. I DO NOT hunt from one, or use one to hunt with! I cut wood for heat and haul it with a trailer attachment etc. I complained to the Colorado authorities about it(while I was there two years ago), tried to make a written report. They run the Elk deeper and ruin it for everybody! Not to mention erosion problems and Beer cans. They bring with them a lot of issues. I joined the BCHA’s just to fight these ATV riding slobs!
JMHO folks.:)

[David Petersen]

#34704

Hiram — Indeed, Missionary Ridge is my backyard and I too have been run out by illegal ATVs in the backcountry there. I don’t fully understand the link between black powder hunters and heavy ATV use (and nonstop bugling, often without even getting off the machine), but it absolutely exists. Per capita, there seem to be more ATVs out there for black powder season than even the rifle seasons, which are bad enough. Worst of all, the 9-day bp season is in mid-Sept., smack in the middle of archery season and what would be the best bugling week of the month. The bp boys come riding in and before opening weekend is done, all daytime real bugling has stopped. Somebody at DOW was sleeping when they let that small user group get that prime season.

Anyhow, all I meant to say is Thank You! for reporting it. If every hunter and forest user who had his own access limited or denied because of ATV abuse and overuse would report and complain, maybe we could make more progress in restraining them. CO BHA is currently talking with DOW about posting a reward, through the DOW’s “Catch a Thief” hotline, for info leading to conviction of ATV outlaws. It works well in MT but DOW his, under current leadership, has little stomach to become further involved in the problem. Most game wardens I know would love to get more aggressive; the weakness is in Denver. Anyhow, we’re working hard to restore quality to the hunt. Thanks for your help. Take away the motors and Missionary Ridge would be among the best elk holes in the country. It used to be. dave

[turtlebunting]

#34754

when i first started this forum i thought everyone hate atv riders on here… i keep read post after post of ppl putting down atv riders. and i just wanted to say i respect public land and where many ppl dont.

i have to say riding ur atv up and turn it off and start bugling…well i have to say about thats is….stupied as hell!!!!

[Hiram]

#35519

turtlebunting wrote: when i first started this forum i thought everyone hate atv riders on here… i keep read post after post of ppl putting down atv riders. and i just wanted to say i respect public land and where many ppl dont.

i have to say riding ur atv up and turn it off and start bugling…well i have to say about thats is….stupied as hell!!!!

Yes my friend! you see the issues. They are NOT from people like yourself, but rather those do not crave the purest form of refreshment the Field has to offer.

I for one say “Nay” to less an experience.
Yes! “Can’t cheat the mountain Pilgrim! The mountain has it’s own ways” Using ATV’s on the “Mountain” will “Cheat” US all from what it has to offer! And in doing so, in the end, the Mountain will be “Cheated”.

[Hiram]

#35631

[Backcountry Joe]

#50503

I’m new to the site and chiming in at the end. I tend to shy away from hunting sites because topics of OHV and Wilderness discussions. It’s nice to see a level headed debate.
As far as ATV abuse issues on public land, there are several conservation groups fighting for the heal toe express style of hunting. If this is truly a sore spot,consider joining one of these groups.

TRCP, TU, and Backcountry Hunters and Anglers are three that I can think of off the top of my head. BHA has sent sportsman to DC several times in the last year. I went in December and a freind went just last week. The lobbying world isn’t for everyone, but Senators and Congressman hearing from sportsman about real issues can be very powerful. You don’t have to be an active member, just supporting helps a ton. If joining a conservation group isn’t your thing, writing a letter to your state Reps. is helpful also.

If anyone would like more info feel free to E-mail me at outlawoutfitters@hotmail.com or visit backcountryhunters.org

[T Downing]

#50612

Yeah Hiram, well said my friend! And then to show the final scene in Jeremiah Johnson, oh bro, those final scenes speak a thousand words in tribute to the mountain and those of us who are blessed enough to get there…

[tom-wisconsin]

#52956

We need to preserve roadless areas or areas were only natural sounds can be heard. We need to preserve the natural sounds so we know how that is. Before gunpowder time was a long history of natural sounds. We have very few places and times to experience this. A lot of people have to have music in there ears or the TV on even to go to sleep. Some times I think people are afraid to just be with their thoughts. We are running away from ourselves when we do this.

[rnorris]

#56013

It sound sto me like east vs west is an entirely different animal regarding ATV use and abuse. We have one in camp, and it gets used much like a pickup truck….on the roads, not in the woods. I have used it, and it has never gone anywhere with me on board that my truck wouldn’t. Even in the western UP….the most remote part of Michigan…we don’t have enough land to go bombing around the woods and not expect to run every deer out for miles.

It’s a handy vehicle for hauling, just like my pickup is. We are always a vehicle or 2 short in camp and it comes in handy. BUT….my favorite method of locomotion is my feet. I will often have one of the guys drop me off in the morning, and walk out…I never quite feel right with a long bow on a atv.

As for crashing around in the woods with one? Never.

[Author]

Posts