Arrow Speed/Weight Set Up-Opinions

[wojo14]

#7645

ok, found a bow i absolutly love! a northern mist baraga.

i feel super comfortable shooting it and i think i shoot it pretty good.

i finally got arrows tuned for it.

570g total weight. 29% efoc.

the bow is throwing these arrows at 140-145fps. is this ok?

i am questioning if speed has any play in a good shot and kill. 😕

i am drawing 49# on this bow. that puts the arrow at 11.6gpp.

what is all your opinions on this set up?

what would you feel comfortable hunting with this set up?

-white tail? small game? pigs? blackbear? elk? moose?

[Stephen Graf]

#8148

Hmmmm… Firstly, this advice is worth exactly what you paid for it.

In my experience shooting wily and nervous whitetails that have been dog hunted for 400 years (the south 🙁 ), your odds go way up if your bow shoots at least 160 fps.

If you had some kind of super heavy extreme FOC arrow that would maybe compensate for a bad hit, then maybe. But the arrow you specify isn’t really all that heavy. It doesn’t meet the Ashby 650 grain threshold for bone busting.

It also really depends on what your goal is. If you are willing to wait all season for a 10 yd or less shot and can go without meat otherwise, then ok. If you need to feed the family, then I think you might need a faster setup.

I own a 50lb Northern Mist longbow too. But I could never get the performance out of it to justify using it. I imagine in much higher weights, 70lbs plus, the bow does fine. But in lower weights, it’s just too slow.

I was shooting a 600 grain arrow out of my Northern Mist and getting in the mid 130’s. This should not be taken as a disparaging comment about the bow. It has many great features. Speed is just not one of them.

What I did learn from the Northern Mist bow, and maybe what you have learned too, is that you like the american semi long bow. There are many other makers out there.

Before you buy, you can always press them for real performance data. Ask them at what speed their 50b bow will shoot a 650 grain arrow. As I said before, my threshold is 160 fps. In fact, I will sacrifice some arrow weight to get that speed when shooting deer.

My 48lb home made american semi long bow drawn to 28 inches, will cast a 620 grain carbon arrow 163 fps. Four deer are in the freezer this year, taken with this bow.

You asked a good question. I hope I have answered it in kind. There are those that will claim speed is irrelevent. I am not in that camp.

[Brennan Herr]

#8402

Jason,

Good post! I look forward to learning as well.

[wojo14]

#8534

steve, thanks for the response. lots of good info there!

brennan, ya, i have been thinking about this for a while now.

i know that we all want to shoot the heaviest arrow with as much weight out front as possible. but, at what cost?? these animals react quick to noise and i dont want to put a good shot out there just to have a deer jump the string!

i am not a speed freak at all. but, i want a heavy arrow that gets to my quarry with a reasonable speed!

i am curious on everyones opinion and experience on this subject!8)

[wojo14]

#32756

Steve,

You have a 48# longbow that shoots a 620g arrow 160 fps!?

I want one!

I have shot a ton of longbows in the 46-50# mark and I cant get over 150 with a 520g arrow!

Right now I am shooting a 46# longbow with a 550g arrow at 145fps. I can get 175 with a 350g arrow!:D

This chrono cant be reading right!

No one else want to put their 2 cents in?

I am just curious. I am a believer in as much foc you can get and the heaviest arrow you can shoot, but at that speed cost!

8)

[Col Mike]

#32842

My 2 cents.

20yds = 60 ft–a good ethical range.

OK 30 yds= 90 ft–very limit of my shooting ability.

So the difference in 150fps or 175fps or even 200fps is what?

In my humble experience if the prey spooked it was before the arrow was launched (given you did all the stuff about silent bow and such) which means my stalking skills lacked.

Sorry folks unless I’m shooting Russian made tanks at 3,000meters I really ain’t gonna worry about speed.

My 770gr carbons with 500gr up front 4A&A fletching at 33+EFOC are sufficient for what I do at 20yds. No matter the micro seconds.:D

Mike

[wojo14]

#33188

Thanks for your input Mike!

I totally agree with what you are saying. Sometimes I tend to over think things.:?

I have the same thoughts on this subject as most of you out there. Speed does not kill. Heavy arrows, quiet bows, good woodsman ship, and luck!

But I will say, if the arrow can get there a little faster, it would not hurt.

By the way, the difference between 150fps and 170 fps is VERY noticeable to the eye!8)

[Stephen Graf]

#33222

colmike wrote: …20yds = 60 ft–a good ethical range.

…

So the difference in 150fps or 175fps or even 200fps is what?…

60 ft / 150 fps = 0.4 sec

60 ft / 175 fps = 0.343 sec

The difference being 0.143 sec. A deer can lower it’s back at a rate much faster than simply falling do to gravity. But if it simply dropped by gravity that would mean it could lower it’s back at least: 0.5 * 32 fps^2 * 0.143 sec^2 = .327 ft or 3.9 inches. In my experience it could drop twice that, but this is a conservative number.

As we all know, most misses are over the back. When an arrow moving 150fps is just getting to the deer, the arrow moving 170 fps is already bloody and stuck in the ground behind the deer 😀

A faster bow is also more forgiving imo. For the given example of arrow speeds, the arrow will spend about 15% less time on the bow for the faster arrow. That’s 15% less time for me to screw up :oops:. Flatter trajectory also aids in good shots.

I’m just saying we shouldn’t give up on bow performance and arrow speed in our effort to maximize terminal arrow performance. I don’t care how deep the arrow will stick in the dirt, I just want it to get through the deer first.

My current bow is shooting a 10.4 gpp arrow 183 fps with my 29″ draw and 54# draw weight. It is an american semi-longbow. It will shoot a 650 grn arrow 176 fps.

[David Coulter]

#33336

I’m adding to this with ery limited experience, but heavy on opinion! I’m in the sort of heavy arrow camp, 46# r/d longbow with 630 gr arrow. With this set up, it shoots fast enough to give good trajectory in my effective or accurate range. I’ve seen videos of deer ducking super fast arrows out of compound bows and have a friend that shoots four or five deer a year with a self bow. I think confidence in your gear through tuning and accuracy is paramount.

Steve, I’d love to see photos of your bow and maybe a bit of how you built it. Sounds sweet! Thanks, dwc

[wojo14]

#33347

thanks DW.

I agree with your comment.

I to would like to see bow and hear about it.8)

[Stephen Graf]

#33717

dwcphoto wrote: …Steve, I’d love to see photos of your bow and maybe a bit of how you built it…

Here’s some pictures of it in the thread that had the back pack quiver I made for elk “hunting”:

https://www.tradbow.com/members/cfmbb/messages.cfm?messageid=D00EFCF9-1422-1DE9-ED15B5DA36AD8CCA#D00EFCF9-1422-1DE9-ED15B5DA36AD8CCA

Not much to tell really. I’ve been fooling with the design for going on 10 years now. Standard hill bow. Limb core is eastern red cedar. Riser is Maple and Cherry. Brown glass on back and belly All wood harvested from downed trees out back.

As for the speed thing, I’m not arguing against a heavy arrow setup. I use the heaviest arrow I can too. I’m just suggesting that finding the sweet spot might be easier if we don’t focus on just arrow weight. For me anyway, that’s what I’ve found.

[David Coulter]

#33732

Steve,

That’s a nice looking bow. I don’t think I’ve heard Eastern Red Cedar associated with a fast bow, or any bow. Does the speed come from the glass? Very nice.

I agree with you on the speed aspect. That’s why my hunting arrows came out at 630 gr. With that weight, I can also build up my judos to match.

I’d like to try my hand at a bow someday. I’m thinking about it and would like to do it with all hand tools. Maybe a self-bow backed with rawhide or something like that in the future.

Thanks, dwc

[wojo14]

#33733

As for the speed thing, I’m not arguing against a heavy arrow setup. I use the heaviest arrow I can too. I’m just suggesting that finding the sweet spot might be easier if we don’t focus on just arrow weight. For me anyway, that’s what I’ve found.

Well said! Plese dont take my comments as arguing! I am just trying to learn! Some people are obssesed with speed, others with weight and efoc. I am just trying to find a balance.

Nice bow!8)

[Col Mike]

#33826

Wojo

See you this weekend. Should be some fun shooting and great discussion:D Gonna be nice and sunny after the frost on Fri. morning.

Mike

[wojo14]

#33912

Mike, Cant wait!

We can do what ever!

I have some targets for your 3d range!

We can just hang, BS and shoot at your place!?

I have a new bow I just got this week. A local guy up here built it for me. I have been tuning arrows for it. I would like to put it through some paces!8)

[David Coulter]

#34885

You guys have some fun. Take it easy on them, Mike. D

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